Talk:Sidechan

Sage Freehaven, Rann, Roland, and Kindrift was a trolls that posted ugly stuff. --Dragon-morph 00:02, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Awww, did somebody get butthurt when we didn't kiss your ass over you posting your art (which, admittedly, isn't even all that good)? --Sage Freehaven 06:52, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Everybody knows your a troll in this web. --Dragon-morph 14:36, 31 December 2006 (UTC)
 * Prove it. >:3  --Sage Freehaven 05:38, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

This is NOT a discussion board or forum for these kinds of topics. You are currently in an article's "discussion" page, so, please take this conversation to eMail. First warning Spirou 06:08, 1 January 2007 (UTC)

Question to Mellis (Administrator, Sidechan)
If asked properly, has any artist's art or media being removed from the image-board?,... And since I'm asking a sensible Sidechan Admin, is the server now hosted in Germany (Response not required, if you wish, just trying to confirm the added data about it.) Thanks Spirou 08:56, 3 January 2007 (UTC) This is Mellis here. Yes, I have personally removed images several times after getting polite requests for it. 9 times out of 10 though, our first notification by an artist is in the form of legal, and sometimes physical threats, which we do not respond to seriously, because if they don't want to act like rational people, we don't feel the need to humor such ridiculousness. I don't feel there'd be a need to have to explicitly spell this out to rational folks, which is why we haven't bothered to make a giant section about it - we try to keep our rules 'common sense' rather than a buch of arbitrary text nobody will ever read anyways. Furthermore, the sever Sidechan is currently on was in use, and was in Germany, long before there even was a Sidechan. The reason for this amounts to little more than we already had the server secured at a very reasonable price, so why bother getting a new one? Reading anything into it beyond that is little more than buying into conspiracy theory and popular internet drama-mongering.
 * I handle e-mailed requests from users and, if they ask very nicely, and have actual valid reasons, then it can happen. And yes, it is hosted in germany. (A simple lookup of the IP via ARIN or RIPE would've yielded that information.) Arcturus 14:33, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Which is quite irrelevant as it is nowhere to be found in your ToC. --84.139.184.200 14:40, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * So? Arcturus 15:18, 3 January 2007 (UTC
 * Probably is based on some sort of "Good faith" unwritten policy where as long as there is a legit complaint (Art was on a sold CD and put on internet by disgruntled customer rather than simple redistribution out of VCL) and there is simple civility going on between the artist and admin, then it can be taken down. Sort of a reverse "Squeeky wheel gets the boot" type of policy. Not saying I agree with it, but they DO have their bases covered. --71.115.163.94 16:51, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * If people are very nice, and don't threaten in any way, usually I will be nice in return. BUt, to date, I believe only one artist has ever been nice/not threatened. Arcturus 18:04, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * While i have to admit to being mistaken about the removal requests (for some reason i vaguely remembered something to that effect being on the frontpage of wtfur/lulz), i still think pretending that sidechan is not the same entity as wtfur/lulz, only with (some) different people at the top, is kinda silly. :) --Xenofur 12:30, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

Message to Xenofur
In response to messages and repeated edits by 84.139.184.200 and 84.139.168.37, also known as Xenofur. These edits may constitute harassment and defamation toward the Sidechan service and administrators. You have a history of defamation and supression against Sidechan, if only for the administration's decision to remain free of a DNP list.

I do not believe your current reference has any relevance to an imageboard, if you believe it does then please post another reference where German courts have treated images as 'pornographic writings'. However, it is immaterial if you can find such a reference or not. Let it be known that Sidechan hosts a standard disclaimer for mature websites, very similar to that on fchan, and apparently in compliance with German law. If you believe and feel you must continue to argue, please post a reference that states what a German site must do to make pornography inaccessable to minors. Thank you. --DS|go 18:31, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * I doubt that this is, in fact, in compliance with German law, which is unusually strict on the access of pornographic material to children. In the Criminal Code (Strafgesetzbuch, StGB)
 * Section 11 - Terms Relating to Persons and Subject Matter
 * (3) Audio and visual recording media, data storage media, illustrations and other images shall be the equivalent of writings in those provisions which refer to this subsection.
 * Section 184 - Dissemination of Pornographic Writings
 * (1) Whoever, in relation to pornographic writings (Section 11 subsection (3)):
 * 1. offers, gives or makes them accessible to a person under eighteen years of age;
 * 2. displays, posts, presents or otherwise makes them accessible at a place accessible to persons under eighteen years of age, or into which they can see;
 * . . . (7 other sections that apply mostly to trade) . ..
 * shall be punished with imprisonment for not more than one year or a fine.
 * Reading this summary of judicial decisions surrounding adult forums, at the end of section V (Rechtsprechung fordert „effektiveBarriere“), "Ein Webmaster kann also nicht nur irgendein Schutztor vorschalten, er muss vielmehr ein verlässliches  Schutzsystem benutzen, welches auch einem  Überwindungsversuch unter Einsatz einer „gewissen kriminellen  Energie“ standhält." which translates to "A webmaster cannot thus only use connection protection gate, he must rather use a reliable protective system, which overcomes (even) attempts to use 'deliberate criminal energy'."
 * A disclaimer is not even an attempt at a protective system, let alone an effective protective system - people can just lie to get in. It is the equivalent of a strip club which just asks people whether or not they're an adult without checking any ID. --GreenReaper(talk) 19:20, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Xenofur appears to have added a somewhat more accurate translation of the above to the article just after I looked at it, but the meaning seems much the same. --GreenReaper(talk) 19:25, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Added to that, the disclaimer on fchan is enough because it is hosted in the usa and not my property. --Xenofur 19:30, 3 January 2007 (UTC)
 * Another addendum for completeness' sake: "Writings" is a matter of translation, the original uses "Schriften", which basically means anything that is or can be printed. I'm sure the specific youth protection laws are mroe clear on that, as they are not as old as the STGB, but i don't think it's necessary to add even more clutter. :) --Xenofur 19:35, 3 January 2007 (UTC)


 * how about this: "the legality is disputed" boom (-engine :b) drama over. - cchristian talk 
 * We would rather settle whether or not it is legal rather than leave it disputed, if possible. If there are clear legal statements that apply then they should be used. Some things are a matter of opinion, but we like to keep as few of them as possible. --GreenReaper(talk) 20:35, 3 January 2007 (UTC)

Being that there have been zero actual real legal issues with sidechan ever, this whole drama simply smacks of just trying to stir up garbage in some sort of strange vendetta against sidechan. The whole 'legal issues' is a joke and basically little better than trolling and drama for the sake of starting drama. Xenofur in particular should know better.

Date of Move to German Servers

 * Date taken from http://whois.domaintools.com/lulz.net (domain registration date). As told by Xenofur in #wikifur . Please find a citation or a reliable source. Marked with template. -- JaeSharp 20:42, 3 January 2007 (UTC)