Talk:Extinctioners

Page Organization
Given that this page is currently 55KB long and has a couple of dozen graphics on it, I'd like to suggest that we split this up into a main page for the Extinctioners and a seperate page for details of each character. Thoughts? --Giza 14:13, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * That makes a lot of sense to me. -- Sine 17:46, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Indeed. Perhaps "Character name (Extinctioners)" as a title so it's clear they're linked to this comic, and as a subcategory of Comic characters? --GreenReaper(talk) 17:53, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Is this what you meant or have I made a mistake?RVDDP2501 22:07, 5 June 2006 (UTC)


 * That seems to be fine - I think it's what Giza and Sine were suggesting . . . --GreenReaper(talk) 22:48, 5 June 2006 (UTC)

Ok, I JUST "TRUELY" FINISHED editing the page, please let me know what you think of both the main page and the individual ones as well and if there is anything else you all think need to be done, I want to make things as pleasing to everyone as possible, thank you.RVDDP2501 00:47, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

What happened to my character pages and whats with all the clean ups, how can you clean them up anymore?RVDDP2501 21:05, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

Fan-created Characters
There's at least one fan-comic character (which has not appeared in the comic) in the main character listing. Should these be separated out into a separate character or otherwise marked as such? That would make sense to me, but I don't have enough knowledge of the series to do this myself. --Lynn Onyx 01:31, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Ah, good observation. The person who the character is based on has a page of his own, but the character doesn't so it apparently links to the entry for the actual person instead.  We'll have to confer with Shawntae or Cdr. Wise himself to work out an entry for his character.  Aelius 01:51, 10 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree. There needs to be a listing of canon characters and then maybe fan-created ones. I'm unfamiliar with the title, so we need someone knowledgable on the subject to review the list.--Kendricks Redtail 01:54, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * There are other examples, such as the Sgt. Kratt character from the fan-comic Codename Werewolf. I think characters that originate in fan works should not be listed in with "real" characters. --Lynn Onyx 01:53, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Yes! I totally agree with that, I have reverted it back to my last edit, what else would you suggest I do? - RVDDP2501 01:56, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

EVERYBODY STOP!
I'm not going to sit here and watch RVDDP2501 and HyenaFur sit and revert each others edits to this article! If you two don't CUT it out, I will make sure you both receive warnings! Play nice, play fair!--Kendricks Redtail 02:21, 10 January 2007 (UTC)


 * OK, guys. Please state your arguments for the changes to be made to this page, and try to come to some sort of an agreement rather than just reverting one another. --GreenReaper(talk) 02:26, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Look, there was a dispute over 5 characters; Akina, Foxstar, Kronis, Miki, Rokko, and SGT Kratt. Akina has yet to appear in a comic, but she is a cannon character. Foxstar has appeared in several pictures with Phenix. Kronis can be considered a fan character because he appeared in a fan comic in Issue 14 and 15. Miki and Rokko are two flying squirrels that appear on pate 17 of Issue 15. SGT Kratt was a character made in a fan comic known as Codename Werewolf which appeared on the internet within 1 week of the printing of Issue 15. It did not make the cut for the Third annual or the next Extinctioners issue due to two reasons; 1. It was not made in time for the annual. 2. Shawntae Howard already had several storylines that needed to be closed, so it was not feasable to have it put in the next Extinctioners Issue.

Ok... Well, my problem with this situation is that the pages being added are in regards to characters who are mainly those of fan fictions and should not be included. Also pages added that do concern canon character contain almost no relevent information as well as pictures with no licences. those are my problms with what is happening - RVDDP2501 02:36, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I also want to say make something clear; the reason some of those are vague is because they've only briefly appeared in 1 issue and have yet to make another appearance. Plus, because of my comic, I know certain details that I have sworn never to reveal until they are published, and ironically, it concerns two squirrels. I also must say that no one outside of Shawntae Howard and Ken Singshow has ever taken Codename Werewolf seriously, and have continually called it just some piece of fan crap that has nothing cannon about it. On the contrary, I recieved cudoes from both comic artists on how I kept all the Andorozon characters in character. And had it not been for certain circumstances, it may well have been put in an Extinctioners Issue.

I have one other thing to say; if you're going to eliminate any fan characters, eliminate SGT Kratt, because Foxstar has more cannon cred than him, since he has been in many, many more pics with Phenix and Xenif than anyone else.


 * I don't read Extinctioners and I don't fully understand its layout. If it makes it into an issue, is it considered canon? Or is it like Star Wars Tales, which offers some non-canonical stories? Just remember that until its published it can only be considered fanfiction. Well-written fanfiction if you nailed character characterizations right. But ultimately fanfiction. On a seperate note, is this Foxstar considered canon? Just because he's been in a billion pictures doesn't cover legitimacy unless he is acknowledged by Shawn or Ken to be legit. Reading the article leaves that question very vague, so we'll let it slide until conclusive evidence may be found.

As for uploading pictures with no license, there are license options available in the upload menu. Please take time to familiarize yourself with them before you upload anything. Creating character stubs. Unless there's going to be more character information forthcoming, it's not a good idea to clutter the wiki with stubs. Not every character needs an article, especially if they're of minor importance. This isn't Star Wars where apparently the guy fondling himself in the back of the cantina is named Warf Mugato of Klendar IX, who flies the good ship Lollypop, blah blah blah, longer character history than Luke Skywalker.

Finally, my stance on fanfiction here. If it's a recurring character of a wellknown license, I suppose it's ok. I don't need all details though. All these articles could have been nicely summed up in a long article about Codename Werewolf. I appreciate all the incredible detail that went into creating your pocket universe, don't get me wrong. Also, let's avoid creating articles about Mary Sue's unless you're going to put background info about yourself in with it. I guess that's all I have to say about this. Ciao. Change your underpants.--Kendricks Redtail 03:03, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I must point out that you're arguement is flawed as soon as you made the statement about you don't read the comic. Since you have no experience I don't believe you have the right to make the calls. I've read all the comics and own them all. Look, Codename Werewolf is nothing like the whole Cantina example and it's definately not like Star Wars Tales. The whole story was written so it would be considered cannon rather than a collection of short stories. I wrote the comic so it would fit in perfectly with the storyline of the Extinctioners without a hitch.


 * No single person has the "right" to make the calls. Even though you personally may be more familliar with the comic does not necessarily give you this "right", either.  Articles on this wiki are written through consensus of multiple editors.
 * In the case where edits are controversial, what we usually ask for is some sort of proof that can be provided for the article, usually in the form of a link to another website/blog/etc. Thsoe links are then cited in the main article, which usually satisfies the concerns of others.  If you have any outside pages that we can cite in the article to back up your edits, please let us know.  Thanks!  --Douglas Muth 03:42, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Foxstar is considered cannon even though he has yet to appear in a comic. To date, I am one of the few non-published Extinctioners fan comic artists only because of extrenuating circumstances. I also should point out that Commander Kitsune is also considered a canon character, because he is one of the commanders of the Solar Strike Force.

Look, I've had canon arguements with people before over Stargate SG-1 (it was mostly whether or not the ACU uniform was canon and whether or not it was canon to have a National Guardsmen in Cheyenne Mountain) and over Codename Werewolf, and it is always frustrating for be because no one has an open mind when I tell them about how Shawntae Howard and Ken Singshow liked it.
 * Look, I didn't compare your comic to Star Wars Tales. I compared Extinctioners to Star Wars Tales. As for the Cantina example, the point of that example is the fact that there are fans out there who have taken extras or background events and created whole backstories for these people, all of which are non-canon, unless recognized by Lucasfilm, Ltd. Which you just did. But for you, it's like me drawing a picture for Bill Holbrook of my fox character talking to Kevin and Kell and he said wow, I really liked it. Doesn't mean that you're gonna see me in the next strip or any other strip. Doesn't mean Ken Redtail now officially exists in the KnK universe. I have an extraordinarily open mind regarding these matters. I argue DC/Marvel canon all the time (and that's quite a feat with all their retcons!) So I have a tiny bit of authority, but not much.--Kendricks Redtail 03:47, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

I didn't take a character and create a background. I created a character and storyline that I felt would be highly appealing to people, with the intent of trying to get published in an Extinctioners comic. There is a difference between the cantina example and what I did. The comic is recognized by Shawntae Howard and Ken Singshow, but it cannot be published at this point because of other issues. The preceding unsigned comment was added by Hyenafur


 * Please sign your edits on this page with ~ And please read the license information about pictures, which is found here: Image use policy By uploading images without specifying a valid license or permission, you are subjecting WikiFur to potential legal problems. --Lynn Onyx 03:30, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Done. Hyenafur Karl Kratt

Proposed Resolution
Add the following to the Fan Creations section:


 * * Codename Werewolf is an Extinctioners fan comic created by Karl Kratt, starring his character Sgt. Kratt.

(Code snippet above purposely uses &lt;nowiki&gt; tags for easier copy-and-paste.) This look good to go? --Lynn Onyx 05:08, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

Thank you. Karl Kratt

Request for Information
The publishing history only mentions 2 issues, the first issues of each volume. How many additional issues have been published? What is the current issue? --Lynn Onyx 05:45, 10 January 2007 (UTC)

The current issue is Volume 2 Issue 15. Karl Kratt

From Shawntae Howard
Sorry in advance if this is not formated correctly I am not very familiar with text coding and what not. I was asked to weigh in on this, as I don't totally understand what the conflict is, but as far as I'm concerned the only person who should really be editing the page is RVDDP2501, he is the one that initally contacted me about making it, he's directly asked me what characters should and should be listed and I've given him permission to use images in accordance to the article and I have to say he's done an outstanding job with it. I personally know I could not myself create all that he's done and it's my info.

While I truly do appreciate people making fan characters, I do not believe it is relavent directly in the article since it is an article about the comic and it's characters directly (besides, there are tons of fan characters and it wouldn't be right or fair to feature some and not feature others, otherwise, the editing and addition of an characters could go on forever.) I try never to begrudge anyone creating fanfics, it'd be like the creator of Star Trek telling people they couldn't create their own Federation stories. As updates to information is needed usually RVDDP2501 contacts me to see what should be added and what should be. I haven't looked over the revisions (as of the time of me typing this), but I know prior to me hearing about this, what was in the article seemed accurate and I was satisfied with it (I even use it myself to remind me about certain things on certain characters).

EDIT: Ok, I have now read the whole discussion, while techincally Hyenafur is right in adding the characters Miki, Rokko, and Kronis to the list as they have actually appeared in the comic, fan characters like Foxstar should. Yes he's appeared in a lot of pictures with a canon character (Phenix), those were still commissions, drawings paid for by a fan (a very good one with a cool character but still a fan).

Perhaps a separate page for fan created information could be added, I'm not sure how that works or anything, but I would say that the main page itself should still be about the comic and comic direct characters (and yes, if it's made it into the main comic itself, it is comic canon. Annuals, however, are under the Star Wars Tales rules (as someone mentioned), open stories by fans that happened to have been published).

Any online comic events and information (Such as my online comics Artic Blue and The Adventures of Rokki and Micro) are canon story spin-offs of the printed comic (which has had a total print run to date of 16 total issues with 3 annuals).

I hope this was helpful and again, apologies if this is not submitted in the proper way.

Signed

Shawntae L. Howard Creator of Extinctioners.

Protection status of the article
Since the debate seems mostly over, I'm going to assume good faith and unproect the page. Have fun! --Douglas Muth 05:02, 12 January 2007 (UTC)