Talk:Therianthropy

Is it just me, or do Therians have a huge fucking ego at times? --Mix


 * Many sentient beings have big egos, doubtless including some therians. I haven't met many myself; the one I know best may have a big ego, but if so they don't show it all that much.


 * The marriage between the furry fandom and those of a therianthropic nature is not an easy one. There is a certain level of conscious individualism required for those who wish to avoid getting sucked into the catchall categorization of "furry", and if this isn't expressed well it's likely to result in people viewing that as a "big ego", even if the individual concerned just wants to avoid being lumped in with everyone else. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:04, 13 April 2006 (UTC)


 * What makes you think so? I'm a therian with a big ego, but it's not because I'm a therian. If anything, I think most furries have big egos. Equivamp 13:14, 18 May 2011 (EDT)


 * I have an ego? no, it's just that Dragons are better than all other species, that's all.  I don't know what you are talking about, unless you mean comments like "I'm a were wolf and you have to try it" as if they assume that everyone else is a therian.  - cchristian talk 


 * cchristian, please do not come in here spouting your beleifs about one species being "better than all the others". Many--including myself--do not feel this way, and--as I've seen--you are a big prescence on WikiFur on pagfes relating to this topic, making you, wether you know it or not, some members only glimpse into who as a group, therians are. Spouting extremely biased things makes the therian community as a whole look bad and may keep those who are therians and haven't realized it from wanting to experience it to avoid being grouped with what they perceive as bigotry and distaste for humanity. --Equivamp 13:47, 21 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Oh that's just SherlawkDragon. He's always like that, don't take it personally. A to weather therians have big egos or not, it really depends on the therian. If you are talking about the ones who claim to have physical characteristics ,such as the ability to transform, then I would say that yes, in my experience these individuals tend to have larger egos, but this is not because of them being therians. In fact their large egos probably one of the causes of them claiming to be therians. Most level headed therians however, have rather average sized egos as far as I can tell. --AxleSargos

Reversion
I don't even understand what this is supposed to say, apart from the copyediting problems:


 *  however, some therians have been known to lose control and "go feral", a stage in which they become clinical lycanthropes. they may exhibit behavior such as uncontrollable mental shifting and personality changes. this is usually the result of not being able to the pain any loger and neglecting the techniques, or losing control during a Lycanthopic Mental shift (an extreme type mental shift where the preformer "becomes an animal").

This information neeeds some review. It seems overly generalized, and I question whether therians who "lose control" really do "become" clinical lycanthropes if they weren't before. The references to "pain" and "techniques" don't refer to anything mentioned earlier in the article, and I don't know what a "preformer" is or in what sense it becomes an animal. The changes aren't helpful to this article. What are you trying to say here, and can you say it better? --Lynn Onyx 03:04, 21 January 2007 (UTC)


 * some wolf told it to me...  I was lazy, and copy pasted him.  ^. .^;;  - cchristian talk 


 * Don't just copy/paste what someone tells you! O.o that is one of the seven sins of a wiki!

Self serving?
This:
 * The Werelist - A popular resource that encourages critical thinking and a rational adult perspective on therianthropy

Seems more like an advertisement for this website than an objective listing. Should the description be removed??-


 * Perhaps, or altered, if untrue. Is it a popular resource? Does it encourage such things? I am not in a position to judge, myself. --GreenReaper(talk) 19:12, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * well, Werelist is a therian site that I use. It's safe, trustworthy, friendly, and POPULAR.  so...  yeah...  - cchristian talk 

Therianthropy "Experts"?
What / who really defines what/who is or isn't "knowledgeable" about Therianthropy? I see things being edited like-"This is not a reliable source" or "Refer to a knowledgeable source"...a LOT here... Within a subculture that has only recently barely scratched the surface of all the many different possibilities and ideas/beliefs involving Therianism, who is to judge? Just because someone has a message board are they a 'reliable Source'? If Mr. X has had a website longer than Mr. Z, is he somehow considered more "knowledgeable"? What s the criteria here? Popularity? Is this objective documentation going on here? Or is it a bunch of people competing to promote their friends' and their own websites? I'm asking seriously here........... ~tolerant one-


 * well, therianthropy is a mutch less close knit group than furry. But, if you give me specifics then I might be able to clarify... o. .o;;  - cchristian talk 


 * I can come back on this now. There are many Therians who have devoted time to study Therianthropy and for theories.  some examples are Wolf VanZandt and Savage Tornclaw.  another way to check facts is asking on a site like The Werelist or The Forest of the unknown or any other respectable and level headed therian site.  the people who Don't know are people who claim to have "special insight" and usually form cults that teach what they claim is the "one true way to be a therian", which is preposterous, seeing as Therianthropy is a condition and you can't be  something you aren't by simply joining a group and you aren't less of something simply because you aren't part of that group.  I hope that clarifies it all!   >. .O  - cchristian talk 

Therian Temple
I'm pretty sure we removed that link earlier after a bit of drama with therian. DO NOT put it back. - cchristian talk 
 * This seems to be quite a bit of heated debate. I'm going to leave the edit be for now, but if it becomes an edit war, I will lock down this article. Play nice, everybody. There seems to be a strong consensus of Therians I know that do not wish this part of the article, but as it is a matter of record, the article stays put. We can't just cover our eyes and pretend what we don't like doesn't exist. I'd like to know what other people think though.--Kendricks Redtail 01:51, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I do not believe "Therian Temple" should be a part of this article. The information they have on their website is misleading. Every therian I know does not wish to be associated with them.--Xainy
 * At the same time, it is a group associated with therianthropy and has merit here, does it not?
 * I think it's worth putting, if only as an example of extremism and what to look out for --AxleSargos

Therian and Furry
Is it possible to consider oneself a member of both the Therianthropy community and of the furry fandom? I'd love to know if there really is or not such a thick line between the two, because it seems like Therians I meet are very defensive about claiming they're not part of the fandom, but I myself gladly put myself in both categories. Is this not possible? Lupercaleb 10:29, 30 April 2007 (UTC)


 * But of course it's possible! As Heinlein said, "Specialization is for insects." Saying that Therians can't be furries is sort of like saying if you like stamps, you can't like model railroading (or alternately, if you're Catholic, you can't like I Love Lucy reruns).DuncanDaHusky(talk) 12:57, 30 April 2007 (UTC)


 * You can be both, the main difference is that Furry is a choice, while Therianthropy is not something you can simply "switch on and off"

Misleading...
This article could use a bit of rewriting using these facts:
 * Therianthropy is NOT a choice. Therians cannot just "not be therian" and non-therians have no quick way of becoming therian either.
 * Mental shifts are either Voluntary (meaning the person having them chooses to) or involuntary (meaning the person can't help it)
 * Many Therians do small, unnoticeable things, such as wearing collars and such, to cope with therianthropy.
 * many therians actually DO act like thier theriotype, or a least have instincts or something. unlike lifestyling, they can't choose which ones or when to have them.  and if they are a predator, it can be "annoying"
 * lots of Therians Role-Play. they like to play as P-shifters.  Roleplayer is not commonly considered an insult/

theres a little more, and this is rough and rushed, but you get my points... anyone want to edit these in? - cchristian talk 


 * Most of these are opinions, not facts. Spaz Kitty 20:51, 14 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Thank you miss.Negative! >. .< - cchristian talk 


 * I agree with cchristian. Even if some of those things aren't what some furry would call "factual", they are truthful enough from a therian point of view.  I think they should be included, whether a furry seems to label them as "opinion" or not.

TrueFormWithin.com
I don't know about that last link... if Therian Temple got in trouble, this one talks about "Vampires and the occult". Maybe someone should take a look at it? thanks...
 * I don't know that site specifically, but in an overview article like Therianthropy we don't have to link to every related site, only the top most relevant ones. --Rat 03:47, 30 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I must make a comment here.

Indeed, if everyone got so upset with the group I am associated with, this surely does not deserve a link on this article.

This is simply an "opposing" occult group to the Therian Temple, only its based online around a message board (as well as a myspace.com group), and thus has no official "membership" like the TT does. They have gone on internet radio defaming the Therian Temple, all the while promoting their own very weird view of "Therianism", "Psychic Vampirism", and "Otherkin Occultism".

Every bit as as weird as we (Therian Temple) are, possibly weirder. Only we do not harrass members of other groups online, such as TrueFormWithin have done to Therian Temple members, as well as other members of groups they do not agree with. Hell, IMO, they are weirder than the Temple of the Vampire and their message board, and they are really weird! (Nothing against any of these groups' beliefs systems or against being weird...I'm pretty "weird" myself--but I think these articles, from what I have seen here, are supposed to be what MOST people can agree on-not representing a biased POV) If we were "too extreme" or too "debatable", this definitely fits that bill as well. What do you all think? Peace,

MagusFenrir (talk)
 * I haven't had time to really look at the site... but from that main page (especially that stuff about vampires), I might say it's not a site to link...  I don't want this linked.  I'm tired of repeating this: I don't want radical therian groups linked from this site.  this is FURRY.wikia.com.  Stuff like this belongs on THERIAN.wikia.com.  I discovered Therianthropy through WikiFur, I don't want others who do so to find weird shit like this.  The only community I would link is WereList, as that is one of the most level headed and new-were friendly sites.  If you linked Christian Therianthropy, Forest of the Unknown, WereWolf.com, or Otherkin Network I would say the same thing (none of those are both level/common and notably popular).
 * I don't have anything against Therian Temple anymore, nor these guys, but it is a matter of common-sense good policy: DON'T LINK OUT-THERE/NON-MAINSTREAM SITES. - cchristian talk 
 * (oh, and a PS. note to Magus Fenrir> Vampire Temple isn't well liked and doesn't look very legitamate. but at the same time, Vampire communities are usually...  ODD....)


 * Well I removed it, as it seemed to be more about vampires (mostly sanguine) rathar than Wereism. The ideas about Vamoires were uncommon...  somewhat a radical group...  (I also noticed they called Sex-Vampires "Incubi and Succubi", That's wrong, Those are Demon-kin types, Sex-Vampires are Tantric-Vampires.)  - cchristian talk  16:41, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Misuse of the Term Therianthropy
The article takes pains to give the etymology of the term "Therianthropy," and then goes on to establish a *distinctive* section where it discusses the sub-culture use of the term.

To any educated person, the word "therianthropy" means anything that has both human and animal characteristics, very much as the etymology suggests. It's not, primarily, the name of a subculture, much like the word 'therian,' to any educated person, means NOT some subculture, but is a term that means any mammal that bears live young (as opposed to monotremes and nonmammals.)

An effort should be made in the initial section of the article to say what Therianthropy actually means, because the actual word is quite relevant to english speaking members of the fandom, and doesn't have anything necessarily to do with shapechanging or the modern subculture at all. I'm not against the subculture having its own usages, but I'm against the insular elitism of reinventing a word, in a venue that is trying to CLARIFY matters (wikifur), with no explanation.Furthling
 * I've submitted a modification of the first paragraph; I trust it'll be reverted if it's unacceptable. Furthling
 * But this is an article about the said subculture. Not what the word means.  - cchristian talk 
 * Therianthropic ideas, in the general english sense, are broadly of interest to the furry community, and key to the specialized sense in which the word's used in the subculture. Leaving the artificially narrow sense in which the subculture's decided to use the word unclarified for a general furry readership would be a mistake. I also think the article could maybe use the addition of a little more info on therianthropy in the general sense. Wizard of Le Trois Freres, early Egyptian Gods, that kind of thing.--Furthling 21:21, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

I haven't joined and likely won't because I'm on too many forums already. I just wanted to thank you for the fair representation shown here of Therians. As to the use of the term "Therianthropy" and "Therian", English, like any language is a dynamic thing. It changes. Most words have multiple meanings and words are modified and appropriated to assume new task as needed. The technically appropriate general term that is the companion to "lycanthropy" is "zooanthropy". That term would be recognized as correct by most psychologists (of which I am one).

The reason "were" was phased out (sorta - I still refer to myself as a werewolf) is the reactions people get when they refer to themselves as a "were" or "were.....". If you are going to talk to a Mainstreamer (non-fringe culture) individual about the community, it helps to have a less loaded term to, at least, start with. "Therian" fitted the bill so we appropriated it for our own use. It's quickly becoming an accepted and widely recognized standard. I'm rather open about my own therianthropy and being active in organizations such as Boy Scouts, Department of Human Resources, Easter Seals, Christian Motorcycle Association, and such, I am making some headway toward general acceptance.

Also, I'm gratified to see that, the more we get to know each other, the gap between the Therian and Furry cultures is becoming narrower - the relationship somewhat less charged. Although there is no necessary connection, there is a good bit of overlap and grouchy old Therians like me can't help but to notice and respect the well developed artistic sensibility and skill in the Furry community; and the Furries I know personally are mostly very likable people. I guess the old saw "get to know me - you might like me" applies.

Anyway, I enjoyed the article. Stay well.

Wolf VanZandt

=The Common Misconception=

I want to add that, though it may seem like it, we don't think we're animals. Though we may claim to be mentally, phycologically, or spiritually connected with animals or otherworldly beings, this does'nt make us think we're animals. I am a wolf therian, speaking as a voice to all hiding in the shadows. So before you judge us on social media, just know, we are people just like you.

Thanks, Luka (AKA Mars)