User talk:GreenReaper/General

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This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk) This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from the foundation of WikiFur to 10 September 2005. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

I can't say anything about if I'll be adding things regularly, but I will when I have time/ideas. As for nationstates, its neat to encounter another head of state no? I run The Union of Tinis which is part of the Furry Federation. --Izixs



Thanks for the welcome! I've really enjoyed participating in WikiFur thus far, and I'm glad my contributions have been useful. I hope to continue to be an active participant in this community effort, and I think it's really going to be a success. ^_^ --Flynn 03:34, 10 Aug 2005 (UTC)

No problem! Great, great project. I'll be contributing more as time allows and directing others to it as well. The pro-vanity page policy is an excellent idea. --Osfer

Thanks for the welcome too. I've been having fun with this. I even have my own wiki for my comic Buddies in Big Places, so it was pretty easy to get started here. --Sethtriggs 04:25, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Just want to thank you for the friendly welcome and for all the help and advice you've given me. I'll sort it out and it will be very useful in future contributions. --Ultraviolet

Blue Forest enties[edit]

Hi! I just wanted to thank you for putting work into helping out with entries related to Blue Forest. I was plesantly surprised to see these here! I'm in the process of adding and expanding on some of them, now, and I certainly welcome any tweaking that you think needs to be done. -K.M. Hirosaki 04:47, 15 Aug 2005 (UTC)

You're welcome! You obviously have a few loyal fans who cared enough to start them. I'll be watching, but your pages seem pretty good so far. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:55, 15 Aug 2005 (UTC)

More stylistic suggestions[edit]

Lord forbid, got another bother: We're getting so many dang micro articles, I think a stub-expansion template for the front might be a good idea. I've modified one of the tables to be like that in my Userpage, if you'd like to see what it looks like. I'm just excessivly reluctant to make a template without authorization, and even less wanting to add new things to the front page :) -- MelSkunk 03:04, 17 Aug 2005 (UTC)

This isn't Wikipedia - you won't get flamed for making a template you think will be useful, or for editing the main page. Be bold! :-)
The only suggestion I would make is removing the last entry and the - before it as that pushes it over one line for 1024x786 maximised (I've been trying to keep all the main templates that size). Other than that, it looks good to go. --GreenReaper(talk) 03:07, 17 Aug 2005 (UTC)
I shall go forth fluffily, then! -- MelSkunk 03:12, 17 Aug 2005 (UTC)


No problem. Is there a stylebook I need to refer to? I see that there have been style changes to the page and I'd rather save somefur else the work if I can...--Fferret 19:23, 18 Aug 2005 (UTC)

To be honest, there isn't one right now - WikiFur only really took off last saturday, and it's been such a rush that we've been figuring them out as we go along. The best guide right now is to extrapolate from existing pages and from Wikipedia. If you do things so that they look the same as similar pages, at least it's consistent. Of course, if you think you have a better way of doing it, you could change them all. Be bold! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 19:10, 18 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Keep, Merge, Delete[edit]

In relation to an edit I did on MelSkunk's user page . . .

Hah! Man, you make funny even funnier. -- MelSkunk 00:13, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)


Thanks for the warm welcome GreenReaper. While I only have had a little bit of experience with Wikis in general, I hope that I'll be able to contribute where I can. ^^ Ta! --Composingliger 05:53, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Well, I'm sure you'll learn quickly! Thanks for getting permission for that picture of Mab. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 05:57, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Hmmm... I just noticed that the templates on the front page have been locked now... Hmmm It's a bit of a catch 22 with Wikis isn't it. On one hand you WANT people to be able to maintain, update and improve on things... On the other, there's always people who just like to ruin and vandalise things. I guess it's probbaly the right thing to do, especially being the main page... But a shame that it has to be done. =/ --Composingliger 07:06, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)
They were locked temporarily due to someone vandalising them. They should be unlocked now (unless it's happened again). --GreenReaper(talk) 19:10, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)
And yes, that's OK. Amber said that it's fine to use her art for any of the related articles. --Composingliger 07:10, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Boiler Plate Text[edit]

It is sooo finished @_@


Please link this where ever possible. I've improved quite a few of the templates too in the process. Made up all their connected category pages and so forth. Only thing that needs doing is the voting pages for Template:Ifd and Template:SpeedyDelete. I'll do those in a bit, using Wikipedia as a base to work from.

I have no life, seriously. ;)

--Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 20:57, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)


Troll running though right now:

Thank you, masked stranger! --GreenReaper(talk) 22:15, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)
It's me again (Loiosh). I watch the recent changes page.
Heh. 45 or so pages defaced over 14 minutes, all repaired in a span on 3 minutes. That's some damn nice work, folks! --Duncan da Husky 22:35, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)
If only I'd remembered to set &bot=1, then it wouldn't have flooded Recent Changes! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 22:41, 19 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Delete Craziness[edit]

I'm worried administrators are going a bit crazy with the delete button. I'm seeing alot of Deleted articles on Recent Changes and I think the wiki could do with inforcing the Wikipedia style of deletion. That everything needs to be listed before it can be removed. You can block a vandal right away fair enough but we could end up with possible subjects of writing being discarded just because a badly written stub was made. WikiFur:Speedy_Deletion should be finished soon, you can see how far I've got right now. I really think it would be wise to tell admins to list pages at least for an hour there before removing them, just to see if anyone chips in with content. Pahapse with some policies akin to Wikipedia:Wikipedia:Deletion_guidelines_for_administrators as they generally make good sense. -Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 01:45, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Umm . . . I'm not quite sure you get the point of speedy deletes. Speedy deletes are for bringing articles that deserve to be deleted immediately to the attention of admins. If they already have their attention and are deleted, then that's perfectly fine.
If you look at the delete log, I don't agree with you that people are going crazy. Consider the "content" of the pages that are being deleted - almost all are either plain vandalism, personal attacks, or tests, all of which are valid for speedy deletion - which means deletion on site by admins, whether or not they're listed.
What you are perhaps thinking of is VfD, which is is the process for removing articles that (generally speaking) are considered not appropriate for a wiki. And, to be honest, I haven't seen too many of them, mostly because we are far more inclusive than Wikipedia at this time. Some have been shortened, like fur, because they duplicated Wikipedia information without added value, but other than that . . . --GreenReaper(talk) 03:37, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Ah.. ok I think I see now. Its very late for me and this wiki has offically cramped by left hand with Ctrl+C/V'ing so I'll be brief. n_x; I did reflect the lack of VfD on the template page so yeah..
Thanks anyway for dealing with all my questions and comments. Just to say would it be possible if you could at some point soon put up links to Wikifur:Boiler Plate Text where it might be useful like on Help or Community. I might write up a few 'First Time Here?' or 'First Time Wikiuser?' pages if that would be helpful. Have written my first actual article though, NorthernFurs (UK)! Woo! ^_^ I will offically stop clicking Recent Changes and close my browser now. ;) Speak to you later. -Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 03:56, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
It went great on the help page. Thanks for taking the time to do these. I just hope we won't have to use them too much. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:11, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Signed up for WikiFur![edit]

GreenReaper, seeing as you already knew who I was anyway (judging by your comment to my IP number!), is there a way of reassigning those edits to my username? --Sslaxx

I'm afraid there is no inbuilt way to transfer edits - however, I have put a note on the user page for, so that anyone who goes there will be able to see that you were the person who made them. --GreenReaper(talk) 16:34, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Search Image[edit]

Hi again. I've just been wondering about the search image for WikiFur - Search logo.png. I think it would be nice if it were possible to drop the Wikicities logo and replace it with something of our own. Is that possible (I've noticed that the image itself was locked) or is this a perminant part of the Wikicities branding and thus unchangeable? --Composingliger 17:41, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Hi! It is indeed possible. If you have a suggested alternative, please upload it and link it on the logo ideas page, and if I and possibly others think it looks good, I'll add it in. --GreenReaper(talk) 17:44, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Well I had been considering just a simple resize of MelSkunk's logo - Wikifurmel-vs-1.png - as an intirim solution, or even Seth C Triggs new one. Personally I just find the Wikicities logo to be a bit ugly (and slightly confusing over the search) and think anything would be an improvement at the moment. ^^ *Yawn* Anyway ~ 4:30am! Really should go to sleep now. --Composingliger 18:06, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)
I think I'll use Seth's for there, since we've already got Mel's image once but your button would go great as a link button - I've put it on the about page. Thanks! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 19:26, 20 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Editing etiquette[edit]

First off...nice site. I will admit that I had trepidations about it at first because I could see how this could become just another place to attack each other, but I'm glad to see that stuff like that is kept firmly under control. Gave me something to do when work was slow yesterday. :)

Oh, I knew we'd be getting that. As you say, though, these things can be managed. I don't want this site to be torn apart by personal disagreement.

Anyways...the real question I have is this. There's one article in particular that I don't think is very neutral and I would like to do a massive edit on it. I wouldn't necessarily be removing information in there, because a good portion of it is correct, but I would like to reword and rework it and include some other information to counter what's already in there. Is this acceptable or is a total rewrite of an article seen as a bad thing? Rama

I would say just do it, and then if someone doesn't like it, they can make their own adjustments. If you are hugely concerned about it, you could write it out on that article's discussion page first, and if nobody disagrees, put it in. Up to you! --GreenReaper(talk) 00:12, 21 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Along that same line, if someone removes information from an article, is it acceptable to put it back in? Rama
Now, that depends. :-) It is appropriate to consider what the information was and why it was removed. If, after that, you still feel the information should be present in the article, then you should put it back in. If appropriate, you might want to consider rephrasing the information in a way that means that it cannot justifiably be removed again, either by increasing the evidence supporting it or by reducing the assertion of the information.
That's a bit vague because it depends on the information, so let me give an example - if someone said "PersonA stole and gave out stuff that wasn't his, and he sucks.", and someone else removed it, then I would change it to say "PersonA distributed pirated material belonging to PersonB during the period May 2002 - April 2003, including ThingA and ThingC, as shown at this authoritative site with evidence. Specific-group-of-people Somepeople said he sucked as a result."
Note that the rephraising is far harder to argue with because it is specific, and it does not make any judgement. It leaves that up to the reader. It also happens to be more useful! --GreenReaper(talk) 02:40, 21 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Movie characters[edit]

Could I convince you to use [[Category:Movie characters]] instead? Trying to keep all category names plural where appropriate. I'll move the old ones, this is just for new ones. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:59, 21 Aug 2005 (UTC)

No's your baby. :) Rama

Personal-article Template[edit]

Just noticed your new Personal-article Template. Would you like me to add it to the General section of Templates or Special? And is there anything I should mention about its use? --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 16:55, 21 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Already done those things, but thanks for noticing. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 17:00, 21 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Quick Response[edit]

Hey GreenReaper. Thanks fur the uber-quick response to fix the babyfur article after it was spammed. I must appreciate all you admins do; I imagine the articles undergo inappropriate changes like that somewhat frequently. skippyfox 08:25, 23 Aug 2005 (UTC)

I and the rest of the admins have been great catching vandalism. I imagine we'll probably see a bit of it today since you have the babyfur article featured. Rama 03:16, 24 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Thanks! It's a lot easier now we have a lot more eyes watching recent changes for trouble, :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 03:20, 24 Aug 2005 (UTC)


I'd like to suggest that the page Wikicities Statistics for WikiFur be linked from somewhere on WikiFur, perhaps from Special Pages. Mwalimu 19:39, 24 Aug 2005 (UTC)

We can't edit the specialpages page, but it's linked (along with other stats links) on the about page, in the Statistics section. Perhaps there should be a link to that from the left bar (although there already is a link at the bottom, and on the first word of WikiFur Central). --GreenReaper(talk) 20:31, 24 Aug 2005 (UTC)

AWFR input[edit]

(Great, I finally learn to leave a message in the right place, by screwing up somebody's User Page,...Sorry, Green >.<) GreenReaper, AWFR entry has been rewritten. Honest opinion?,... Spirou 22:38, 28 Aug 2005 (Pacific Time)

Replied in talk. --GreenReaper(talk) 06:19, 28 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Two Speedy Deletes[edit]

I was just checking through the All Pages listing for the WikiFur: namespace and it appears we have two Speedy Delete pages. WikiFur:Speedy Deletion (my own) and WikiFur:Speedy deletion created by Almafeta (the curse of case sensitivity strikes again). What should can be done about the latter one? --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 00:35, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)

You can merge the two together and make one redirect to the other. Personally, I'd prefer the name "Speedy deletion", as that goes with all the other policies and guidelines, and in fact with most of the pages on WikiFur. Maybe it's just striking for you because you've been regularly using too many caps. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 00:40, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)
Merge and updates complete, I've saved the instructions and the facts regarding empty articles needing deleting from the little d page, however copyright violations aren't exactly SpD material so I've removed that. If we start having many of them, I might make a copyright warning template if required asking people to rewrite it without copyright infringement. Also, all templates, template listing and other links are updated, old page will remain as redirect just in case. --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 14:48, 29 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Um, Hi....[edit]

Moved from User: page - was a response to a conversation elsewhere

Depends on where they were posted, and if I still had the chars in their 'original form'. I actually wrote those close to a year ago XD.

I *did* remove the references, and as far as I know, only one Public Site has the non-edited copy. The others are all 'Safe', at least with regards to copyright.

I'm a little curious as to where you saw the stories in question.. Yes, I know the Author doesn't like this sort of thing, but I myself only found out his personal opinion... what, Shortly before Fur Affinity went down? A year ago, I had no idea, and I was just starting to write. --TwoTailedFox 19:07, 3 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Responded privately. --GreenReaper(talk) 20:22, 3 Sep 2005 (UTC)


With your permission, I'd like to use a verison of this template at the Interlingua wikipedia, for articles that are translated. (I know the GFDL means you don't have to ask about anything anymore, but I still like to show people common curtosy by asking first...) Almafeta 15:19, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC)

I'm fine with that. I think we copied ours from Wikicities, anyway. ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 19:49, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC)
Thank you!  :) Almafeta 20:37, 7 Sep 2005 (UTC)

4chan flood[edit]

They've got a Thread going[1] As of now where they continue to attack. I am trying to derail them by convincing em its useless but they won't stop... Suggest protect or lock on the site with your last main message on This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 11 September to 3 November 2005. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

Trying to start a new chat with GreenReaper![edit]

GreenReaper! THANK YOU SO MUCH for helping me figure this place out! And for cleaning up my article, I'm still figuring out how the formatting and stuff works...

--Gavinfox 02:56, 10 Sep 2005 (UTC)

You're welcome! We all had to learn it at some point, so don't be too concerned if you don't get things looking perfect to start with. The important thing is contributing the information, which only you can do - other people can worry about formatting if they care. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 02:59, 10 Sep 2005 (UTC)
Well... I made a WHOLE LOT of changes...uhm, why is it that KYFurs and KyFurs are different articles? is there any way to make it non case sensitive? Also, something that would help the wikifur search FIND articles when people are looking to find furries in kentucky would be useful... any help?--Gavinfox 03:37, 10 Sep 2005 (UTC)
There is not a way to make it case-insensitive (in some cases, it matters) - you just have to redirect one page to the other. Not really sure what you can do about the finding, other than ensure that it is linked appropriately from other pages. Hopefully if they search for kentucky they should find a few links (or if they go through the regional category.
well, should I put my questions here or in the chat you sent me? I put some in the other one... I'm still not great at formatting, but I've tried to change as many articles that could reference kyfurs as possible.. including the mailing lists, which STILL listed fuzzky as the primary kentucky furry mailing list. :( --Gavinfox 03:47, 10 Sep 2005 (UTC)
I tend to put them in both, but if you have to pick one, I'd say talk on the other person's user talk page, because then they get the notice. --GreenReaper(talk) 03:53, 10 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Who are you on FM?[edit]

What is your username on FurryMUCK? There is no user named "GreenReaper" on FM and I wished to speak to you. Could you please send a pagemail to "Rackety" on FM? I wanted to ask you a few questions. I might also be able to provide you with some images to use. Thank you.  :)

Replied privately. --GreenReaper(talk) 07:44, 14 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Burned Furs/Furrlough/Barr Wars Etc[edit]

Hey there, just wanted to say thanks for the consideration...yes, I admit to being biased somewhat in favor of the Burned Furs, but then again I was in the thick of all that. At one point, 10% of AFF traffic was just me. Fielding attacks from people bound and determined to paint the lot of us as anti-gay, pro-Nazi psuedofascists became an all-time job. So I'm a bit biased there. -;>

Also glad to have been able to add to the other bits: again, I'm a long-time furfan (about 12 years going now) and have witnessed or been directly involved in a lot of this stuff. --

No problem! I have the opposite situation - I know very little of the history of the furry fandom. Fortunately, I can rely on those within it to fill in the details or adjust things if they are incorrect - all I have to do is help them with the technical issues of doing it, or (occasionally) mediate when they cannot agree. It seems to work out, so far at least. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 07:11, 14 Sep 2005 (UTC)
I do need to point out, though, that Burned Fur was never, at any time, "anti furry". We were anti-bad-press. Our entire point was that using common sense and a little discretion would solve pretty much the entire problem. We did not advocate "running people out of the fandom". But there are easily a dozen posts to WikiFur alleging various acts or intents on our part which exist only in the minds of those making the allegations.
For example, the section on FAASA refers to that group's desire to "remove bestialists and zoophiles from Furry Fandom", then goes on to suggest the problem FAASA raises is one of "sinful" activities --- as opposed to out and out illegal activities, which bestiality and zoophilia are. There's no issue of "sin" here; it's a crime being talked about. For that matter, Burned Fur never talks about "sin" at all nor does it couch any of its arguments in religious terms, yet the article on FAASA claims that "all Anti-Furries" of the period shared the religious angle. In the following section, both FAASA and Burned Fur are specifically listed as Anti-Furry (as opposed to just being referred to in the previous link) --- which is essentially an advocation that bestiality and zoophilia ARE part and parcel of Furry Fandom.
I will state, however, that complaints were in fact lodged with the Alt.* hierarchy regarding, expressly because threads promoting the bestiality and zoophile lifestyles appeared there. The promotion of illegal activities is against the Usenet charter, so we simply informed the Usenet authorities that the system was being abused. They warned the posters, who took down the thread, and that was that...just as it's supposed to work whenever anyone anywhere on the Usenet abuses it to promote illegality. No one contacted any carriers to have the group yanked, and it would have been an extensive waste of time and effort to even try calling a tiny percentage of the necessary carriers.
All in all, it looks like the article was written by someone on the opposing side. For example, it's true that "only" two members of the fandom were defending the group --- which amounted to any given standard for an AFF flamewar; you generally only had two or three dedicated people per side, with maybe a handful of kibitzers chiming in at odd intervals. Manawolf's linked "counteressay" starts right off attacking "hate and intolerance" --- against bestiality and zoophilia.
Although Manawolf makes clear she understands the issue is ONLY over these two issues, she calls for "an effort to understand and accept". This is illegal activity. It can't lawfully be condoned. She appears to be ignorant of this, but ironically throws in the accusation that FAASA is "ignorant". Of what, she doesn't say. She DOES, however, argue in a separate essay for the presumption of morality concerning bestiality. Assuming one were to accept this at face value, it still wouldn't address the illegality. She also claims that no one's ever assaulted her idea of trying to moralize the act of sexually brutalizing an animal, which is false: I have. She simply ignored it.
These errors and presumptions should be corrected.
Whew. That's a long post. Here's an equally long reply:
Firstly, I would say that overall (and in my view), the Burned Furs were, in fact, intolerant of specific people or groups who considered themselves within the furry fandom. If their members were tolerant, they would have tolerated the state of affairs. The point is that they did not wish to tolerate it, and instead called for action to dissuade people from representing themselves as members of the fandom - or optionally, to create a whole new fandom without them. When there are documented examples of Squee Rat using phrases like "nutballs", "expel every last wacko from the fanbase" and "twitching crack babies", it is hard to believe that at least some Burned Furs did not, in fact, want these people to leave the fandom. This is not a case of just getting them to be more discreet. It is a case of not associating with them at all.
I understand your position regarding illegality being the motivation (although, again, the above statements suggest that there's a certain about of moral judgement in there as well). It is a valid concern. However, I disagree with your statements that seem to imply that zoophilia (or, indeed, bestiality) is universally an illegal act. It is true to say that it is illegal in many areas, either specifically or under the guise of animal abuse (though I'd say that abuse would have to be proven).
It is possible that the contributors who wrote the article up until that point were "against" the Burned Fur movement, or at least saw it in a detrimental light. This may simply reflect the average community view (which is not to say that it is the correct state for the article, but it is understandable).
I'm not sure where you get the "against the usenet charter" from. Each newsgroup has its own charter - the one is here. I agree that such posts might be against acceptable use policies.
I can't comment on Manawolf's actions, either, as I do not know the history behind them. If you can provide her stated assertions and the evidence refuting them (assumably you made your statements at a prior date to hers), that might be useful information. Note that WikiFur isn't intended to continue conflicts, it might have relevance to the Burned Fur article, if she was involved with the Burned Furs.
I would however say that an argument for the morality of bestiality is also an argument against the illegality of acts related to them, and that if the essay were accepted by readers it would address both moralistic and legalistic dilemma. That is, if people accepted that such acts were morally justified, they would be in support of repealing such laws as there were (and if such laws existed, they wouldn't be supported). Thus, the article attempts to indirectly affects the legal view by appealing to a change in the moralistic values. This is exactly what she means by "an effort to understand and accept". It is the same argument that marijuana users might make, despite the fact that in some areas the use of marijuana is illegal - that it shouldn't be, and that people should accept that some people want to use it.
To take a more related example, it might be illegal to have sex with another person of the same gender, but perhaps it should be legal to advocate it, in the hopes that if people agree with your right to do so, you won't get a bad reputation anymore. Obviously bestiality/zoophilia is not at this point yet, but then nor was homosexuality 60 years ago. Opinions can change, though laws are slower to do so. --GreenReaper(talk) 09:05, 14 Sep 2005 (UTC)

I will remind you that I did not claim that Burned Furs were "tolerant" of those things they spoke against. I specifically said they were not. And no, I have not said that there was not a desire for certain people to leave the fandom. If I believe a President should be impeached for specific reasons, this does not amount to anything wrong --- it is simply my opinion. Even if I call for other people to join me in that impeachment call, neither is that wrong. We are not talking about a lynch mob here.

"Not associating" with the aforementioned people neither created nor solved the problem. The problem was that many furries found themselves hounded from the fandom by their friends, family, and sometimes even their employers, because of the poor word of mouth --- and later, press coverage --- the fandom obtained. Every scrap of that bad coverage and poor word of mouth has concerned people who refuse to be discreet in their sexual lifestyles. Going right back to your own quote of Squee Rat, I note that "expelling every last wacko from the fan base" comes up as a matter of idle fantasy, not a matter of actual intent. Sure, and I'd like to see the Republican and Democrat Parties as a whole rise up and throw out all the scumbags, but I don't think you're about to suggest that I'm going to base a political movement on this premise.

The simple fact is that, if Furries with alternate lifestyles did not try to press upon the rest of the world just exactly what their lifestyles ARE, there would not be a problem.

And why do ANY of us HAVE to know? It was never my business to know that the friendly gryphon down the street masturbates to Road Rover pics off the Internet, so if he MAKES it my business, do I not have the right to be offended? Why am I not allowed to accept someone without having to know that he swings both ways and screws a stuffed pig named Mimi on Saturdays? This is the problem --- there are people in the fandom who are not satisfied with having a sexual lifestyle different from others. For these people, it must be made public, and more importantly must be ACCEPTED, as though my opinion meant a damn to him in the first place. And if I don't accept, if I have any kind of problem with any given thing he does, I'M the one attacked for being "hateful".

"However, I disagree with your statements that seem to imply that zoophilia (or, indeed, bestiality) is universally an illegal act."

I may have wound up clipping it out, but I thought I noted that bestiality is not yet illegal in a handful of states. Nonetheless, it does not have to be universally illegal for it to be opposed where appropriate. The reason I included the term "zoophilia" is because the original article defended it under the same terms as bestiality, and in zoo circles the two terms are often interchangeable.

That said, it's also a fact that one can be a zoophile and NOT break any laws. Drawing a picture of a man raping a sheep isn't illegal, for instance. Nor is selling it. As long as the animal in question is entirely fictitious, no laws are being broken. Of course, the same is true of someone who draws pictures of babies being strangled. If someone is offended by any of this, they certainly have the right to voice their disapproval. That is neither censorship nor fascism of any stripe, but FAASA and BFs were routinely accused of such by their opposition.

I mention Manawolf, and her views, because they are directly linked right from the FAASA article, and presented as a core point of the opposition to FAASA.

"This is exactly what she means by "an effort to understand and accept"."

I'm sorry, but that's not a logical statement and must be taken out of context to effect the meaning you seem to wish to attribute. What Manawolf said, specifically, was that bestiality and zoophilia should be understood AND ACCEPTED. You cannot make an "effort" to "accept" something; either you do or you don't. I cannot make an "effort" to enjoy refried beans or asparagus. The only thing I can do is make an "effort" to wolf them down and try not to taste them while I'm at it. You can eventually change your mind as to what you will or won't accept, but if my opinion in FAVOR of bestiality would be respected, then my opinion AGAINST bestiality should likewise be respected, even if not agreed with, and Manawolf has made clear she does not respect any opinion which does not approve of it.

Manawolf certainly has every right to call for a revisitation of the issue, and make her case, and if she does not convince enough people that the law should be changed, then she has lost and that's that. To date, she has not won her case, but you seem to be suggesting that until she does, I should act as though she already has.

There can be no legitimate comparison of homosexuality and bestiality for this singular reason: animals are not sapient, and as such cannot give consent. Manawolf's argument, that an animal can indicate a desire for sex (and thus consent) ignores the fact that a human child may do the same and yet remain legally incapable of giving consent. The capacity for consent is not based in law upon whether or not someone is technically capable of signaling a desire for it --- it is based on the presumption that a person will, over time, develop the capacity to use calculated judgement in deciding where, when and how they will have sex. Animals never develop that calculated judgement, and thus cannot give consent.

Thus, bestiality will always be exactly what it is: abuse of animals for sexual gratification, and animal abuse should not be tolerated. If society is to say differently 60 years down the road, fine, but society does not say that now, nor does the law where applicable. --

Just so you know (DMFA)[edit]

You are right in believing that the Wikipedia article Dan and Mab's Furry Adventures, which was copied onto the Wikifur article Dan and Mab's Furry Adventures, was created by fans of the series. Actually, it was initially started by me before realizing I hadn't logged in. ^^; Poofyspikes 01:46, 16 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Hehe, yeah - I seem to remember the forum thread on The Nice. That's how the system's meant to work, so it's good to know it is. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:25, 16 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Happy birthday![edit]

And enjoy your cake.  :) Almafeta 13:01, 19 Sep 2005 (UTC)

Many Happy Returns and best wishes on your Birthday! n_n --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 13:16, 19 Sep 2005 (UTC)


(From User Talk:JSB) - "You know, you can always revert it yourself! Just click History, then click the date and time prior to the vandal's edit, then click Edit, then save, and it's back where it started from. :-)" I think this should be in a nice, prominent place - the "Help" page, for instance? :) Tevildo 21:26, 2 Oct 2005 (UTC)

Then be bold and add it in! ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 21:33, 2 Oct 2005 (UTC)
Done. Didn't know ordinary users could edit the Help page. :) Tevildo

This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 4 November 2005 to 18 February 2006. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

Hi! *fluufff*[edit]

thanks for the greetings! i am already active on (mostly german) wikipedia, and i plan to add more entries about furscape and the austrian furries here. this is great!

Unci 08:56, 3 Nov 2005 (UTC)

Glad to have you! It's always good to have contributors who already know about MediaWiki. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 05:35, 4 Nov 2005 (UTC)


Thanks for fixing my entry. Still a bit of a noob when it comes to wiki entries, etc. :) H.

No problemo. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 05:26, 4 Nov 2005 (UTC)


Thanks! I'm excited to join the team and hope to be a aid to the community as a whole. I took on a big project pretty early to my Wiki career, the What is Furry? article. Myself and Giza are undecided as to wether or not the sexual nature of being furry should be included on this page. Some discussion between me and him carried over from the discussion page on the artical itself. It boils down to the impact of drawing potentially harmful attention to the fandom through the sexual aspect. Your thoughts? --Omnibahumut 06:19, 16 Nov 2005 (UTC)

Hey, thanks for the welcome. Sorry this reply is a bit delayed; I tend to procrastinate a lot. ... Mainly because I keep getting to this point in my reply and hitting writer's block about what to say next, then I get frustrated, and decide I'll do it later... I'm just going to leave it at "Thanks for the welcome" for now. Hopefully I'll be more verbose later on. KaloFoxfire 17:35, 25 January 2006 (UTC)

Bowman's Wolf,...[edit]

Actually, that was one of the articles I entered in Wikifur. It wasn't vandalism, just vandalized,... <=( Spirou 04:27, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)

Yipe! Sorry, restored. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:29, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)
No problem, Thank you very much =) Spirou 04:31, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Welcome back, GR... :) Carl Fox 05:06, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Thanks! I'll be letting people know about my trip, since it relates (somewhat) to WikiFur. :-)
By the way . . . if there ever happens to be an ugly red link on the main page, you guys can fill it. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 05:09, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Consider it done, O Fearless Leader.  :) Carl Fox 05:36, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Thanks! Sorry for not doing it myself earlier, but I was somewhat internet-less. *grin* --GreenReaper(talk) 07:04, 21 Nov 2005 (UTC)


Oddly enough, I had one of those forehead-slapping moments yesterday when I realized that I can take my work laptop with me when I go traveling for Thanksgiving. So I'll end up having some connectivity during the holiday after all and will be able to keep an eye on things here. --Dmuth 15:03, 22 Nov 2005 (UTC)

Great! I should be around as well . . . and I'm sure we'll have a lot of visitors from people who actually have time to read the leaflets they picked up at MFF. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 14:50, 23 Nov 2005 (UTC)


Hmm. (Grins stupidly) Um. I apparently forgot I already had a username on can delete either one (Lone or LoneWulfe) 'cause...I hadn't worked on my little page in so long, I'd forgotten I had to make a name. I just wanted to let you know that it is indeed the same person...and that I am indeed an idiot. Let me know iffen you'd like to delete either one - I'm more than happy with either name, myself.

(Will promise to stop being dumb)

Well, if you still have the same email address (and put that address in when registering) then you can ask to have the password sent to you via the login page . . . --GreenReaper(talk) 07:31, 26 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Hmm...well, I do have the passwords to both, I just wasn't sure if you'd wanna get rid of one since both names are registered to me and I dun honestly need both. I won't complain 'bout it...I just dun want it to be an inconvenience or anything.
Ahh. No, don't worry about it (I'm not sure we can delete accounts, in fact - you'd probably have to ask jasonr at wikia dot com) - just use whichever one you prefer from now on. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 08:23, 26 Nov 2005 (UTC)
Okay, that's fine with me - no worrie sin that case. I'll just use this one, then...thanks for the help!


Thanks for the warm welcome! It's really Nidonocu's fault that I'm here. Still getting used to everything though. :) --Graafen Blackpaw

Yes, whenever something goes right on this site, I know who to blame - Nidonocu, or one of our other administrators. Yet they keep doing it! *sigh* --GreenReaper(talk) 08:48, 10 Dec 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome![edit]

I'll just take a moment and thank you for the warm welcome. It's much appreciated. From what I've seen, this community is a good one, congratulations on creating something so successful. --quoting_mungo 07:50, 10 Dec 2005 (UTC)

You're welcome! I'm glad that WikiFur is a success, but honestly, anyone could have founded it given the great response we've got from the community; I just happened to be the person who decided to start the ball rolling. As the good Dr. Strangelove almost said, the technology required is easily within the means of even the smallest furry fan - it required only the will to do so. And, heck, I couldn't think of anything better to do with my evenings. ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 08:48, 10 Dec 2005 (UTC)

Australia Furries[edit]

I was just wandering what events furs can have in Australia, it seems all the action is at america or canada, i just wanted to know if there was anything on here *hugs* im new to the sight, saw a chance and took it to ask. *snuggles* please reply. --Furrywolf

The only one I know of is MiDFur - the "Melbourne in December furmeet". I would suggest asking about it in Ozfurs. Further furry information about Australia can be found in the Australia category. --GreenReaper(talk) 23:49, 17 Dec 2005 (UTC)

Getting started...[edit]

Hey, thanks for the message.

At least I'd be productive and do something for the furdom ^^

Re: redirect from Footboy[edit]

Hi there, and welcome to WikiFur! I noticed this edit, but the edit summary wasn't particularly enlightning to me - could you let me know what the issue was with the redirect? --GreenReaper(talk) 09:43, 9 Jan 2006 (UTC)

I'm Footboy. I severed the redirect on that page because someone advised against directly linking my forum name to my furry one. Unfortunately I don't know how to delete the Footboy page entirely. Sorry for the confusion. ^^
Ah, OK. Well, if that is your request, and there's no pressing historical reason to link the name, I don't see a problem with getting rid of that. --GreenReaper(talk) 07:18, 12 Jan 2006 (UTC)

Welcome and comics[edit]

Hi there, Ricardo, and welcome to WikiFur! Thanks for telling us a little about yourself and your works. Let me know if you need any help not already provided. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:29, 20 January 2006 (UTC)

Hi there GreenReaper. I´m glad i make my way to WikiFur through Fur Affinity link. I´m not having any problem creating my pages and I hope you don´t mind it.
I'm glad you did, too! You are welcome to create the pages about you and the things that you have done (and other things, if you know about them :-).
I saw some people I know in here and I thought I could have my name in it too. And I internal-link some of my pages such as Balls of Furr and No One´s Land. I´m still finishing Moon Bunnies and Bound to be Friends. But I have a question: how can I post my comic strips in here too?
Hmm. Do you mean posting all of them, or individual strips? WikiFur isn't really a comic hosting site (it describes comics and contains examples, but not the whole thing), but if you have them hosted elsewhere it may be possible to link to them in some fashion, if you think that would help. I notice you have already uploaded sample pictures for several of them (which is good!).
There´s this Comic of the Week thing that I find interesting. I have lots of strips ready to post and I´m in the making of more yet.
Thanks! --Rcanheta
Yes - the Comic of the Week (recently added) is intended to highlight a particular comic and the article about it. It is basically the "Featured article", but just for comics, because we have so many of them. It is based on both how many nominations it gets (if any) and how good the article about the comic is. --GreenReaper(talk) 09:23, 21 January 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for Darrel Exline[edit]

Thanks for the work on Darrel Exline. He deserved a longer article but for various reasons I felt that I could not do him justice. drew kitty

You're welcome. It's still not perfect, because I don't know the guy and I'm sure he's done other things worth recording, but perhaps it's better to start it off by writing the more "difficult" parts from that perspective. All I really did was look at the material available to me and summarize how it looked overall to me. Sometime's that's what's required. --GreenReaper(talk) 03:08, 24 January 2006 (UTC)


Hey GR, I was just curious how long it took the Creatures Wiki to be added to the DMOZ, and if they actually sent you a response or you just found it added one day. If you could response over at Redwall that'd be great. Thanks --LordTBT 01:23, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Heh, they finally added it? It can take a while if there's nobody actively looking after it. I was tempted to apply, but it was just too much effort. But yes, it can take several months. --GreenReaper(talk) 09:13, 31 January 2006 (UTC)

Anthrocon's room block[edit]

I don't think it's smaller than last year (I don't have the exact numbers, as Kage handles the hotel stuff, so I could be wrong), but I do know for a fact (as also stated in the linked to post) that it's filling up faster than in previous years. Just wanted to point that out. :-)

On the subject of a room party, maybe we should put up a survey closer to the con, asking who would attend? --Dmuth 18:26, 8 February 2006 (UTC)

Hmm. Lessee - the Wydham Franklin Plaza has 757 rooms, of which some unknown percentage were rented out due to prior commitments. The Westin Pittsburgh Convention center has 616 rooms, all but a few of which will be used by Anthrocon. I'd guess that there's probably a slightly smaller room block this year, but the difference is likely negligible - a few dozen, perhaps.
As for a room party, I'll be glad to stop by and slouch bonelessly in a corner and try not to fall asleep :-) --Duncan da Husky 18:58, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
I was given to understand that the room block was smaller because of the rushed move, but I could be wrong - I guess if Anthrocon did actually manage to book those days then it would have the full use of the rooms (as you'd expect for a convention hotel). I had trouble booking for the 14th myself, and I had a good time at MFF just arriving on the first morning, so I went for arrive 15th - depart 18th. I figured it was better to have WikiFur users get into the main hotel as I learnt at MFF that it can be a bit of a hassle going to and from overflows (though admittedly that was across a freezing parking lot ;-).
The survey does sound like a good idea, perhaps a month or so before so there's time to organize anything that people ask for. --GreenReaper(talk) 20:00, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Going from memory (again), we had somewhere around 500 rooms in our block at the Wyndham. Something about going to them with only a few months notice due to the Adam's Mark closing, and all that. I don't know offhand what the size is at the Westin.
Regarding getting ALL the rooms in the hotel, I don't think that's EVER happened in our history. Even at the Adam's Mark in 2004, there were a few dozen guest rooms and one function room that were already "spoken for" when we wanted to have our con.
Regarding your issues making reservations, if it was recently, doubles sold out on the night of the 14th (Wednesday). Hotels only have so many different types of each room (and each convention there has different demands, of course), so stuff like that happens.
Yes, I am particularly scared that the hotel is filling up this early. o.O
--Dmuth 20:39, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Well, I was going for a King size, but it seemed I couldn't get one of those either for the whole time. I'm fine coming in during the morning, though - gives me time to wake up (and it's more money that I can put towards the fandom rather than the convention support industry).
And yes, I don't think you need to be worried about not filling your room block this year. Seems like it'll be a good year to go to AC! ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 20:52, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Couldn't get a king size? That's interesting. Either those have sold out too(!), or the hotel is getting confused. That seems to happen to some degree every year, regardless of which hotel we deal with. --Dmuth 23:21, 8 February 2006 (UTC)
Perhaps there was a convention the previous day and they had taken the rooms for the day? I'm not sure why, either. Still, as long as nothing hugely essential starts before 12 or so, I should be fine. And if not - well, it's my fault for leaving it too late. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 03:42, 9 February 2006 (UTC)

This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 19 February to 5 April 2006. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

Upcoming hiatus[edit]

Just letting you know, I'm moving to another city on or around the 24th of this month, most likely New Orleans. Because of this, I won't be available regularly for a while after this week. -- Siege 22:10, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Don't worry about it - people come and go (and usually come back again :-) all the time. Good luck with the move - I hope you have great fortune in the Big Easy, or wherever you end up. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 00:01, 20 February 2006 (UTC)

By Cesarin[edit]

Hey there GreenReaper, not sure where I can post or ask this, wondering if you can review my own wiki at Cesarin, since I'm from Mexico and I'm still not 100% sure about some grammar values & writting rules. so I ask for your help to see if you can review and fix my errors :>

I actually seem to have missed this note the first time around, but it looks like I dropped by the page anyway. Sorry for not responding earlier! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 05:04, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Furnation Worlds vandalism[edit]

Ahoy there, just wanted to let you know that FurNation Worlds was vandalized a few minutes ago by an IP-only troll. I reverted the page to an earlier edit, I just wanted you to know so you'll hopefully ban that IP from editing. Thanks. Kitsune Sniper 22:29, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for taking the time to spot and revert it! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 23:09, 27 February 2006 (UTC)


Hi there, Aaaamory, and welcome to WikiFur! Thanks for your contribution to the article about your comic. Let me know if you need any help not already provided. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 07:03, 3 March 2006 (UTC)

Hi GreenReaper. Thanks for the welcome. I'm still new. Whee this is fun! Aaaamory 22:16, 3 March 2006 (UTC)


I can inform you with 100% confidence that there is no such thing as a BritFur convention. The site was set up by a Tippus Tailus with the thought that if he announces when and where before even booking or consulting anyone, it'd happen. As such, it is not happening and the site itself is quite simply full of lies.

Therefore, I reccomend the "BritFur" link be removed from upcoming events as it is most certainly not happening!

Thanks for the info - I've removed it from the events calendar. I joined NorthernFurs today so I'll have a look this evening and see if I can find some references on it. --GreenReaper(talk) 20:06, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
If you're on about joining IRC channels, I hang out in #UK on Furnet --SlyCat 20:54, 7 March 2006 (UTC)
Interestingly, since he is mentioned on their web pages, I asked Kage what he had heard about Britfur. He said that he was contacted by one of the organizers offering to have him as a Guest of Honor about two years ago, then received a phone call a few weeks later stating that they wished to reconsider the offer due to the expense. That was the last he had heard from them. --Duncan da Husky 15:40, 13 March 2006 (UTC)


all good, and thank you^^

this is the first time iv used a wiki for other then looking up stuff. i hope to add more stuff on whatever i see intrest in

awsome things these wikis are^^ a bit confussing for a noob, but ill get the hang of it alls --FishyBoner

Thanks for the msg ^_^ --HelenBaby


Thanks for the advice, I'll re-upload some of those illos tomarow (it's late)

This was in regard to some JPG files that would have been better as PNGs. --GreenReaper(talk) 05:04, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Muppet Wiki[edit]

Hi, Laurence -- I just wanted to follow up on our conversation on Muppet Wiki. I think you were left with the wrong impression about us, and I wouldn't want you to pass your misapprehension on to other people at Wikicities.

On my talk page, you said:

That is also the root with my disagreement with your blocking policy - I think that it turns a certain proportion of people away unnecessarily and makes the place less successful than it could otherwise be. I may be wrong, but I look at the other wikis that succeed while allowing people to continue editing anonymously and I find it hard to believe.

You seem to think that Muppet Wiki isn't as successful as other wikis here, and actually it's the other way around. We're currently the #2 most successful Wikicity, with Star Wars at #1. After four months, Muppet Wiki has over 7600 articles, with 50 active contributors and over 500 edits a day.

By way of comparison, Creatures Wiki has 2400 pages, and gets about 30 edits a day. WikiFur has 3200 pages, and about 150 edits a day. Doctor Who has five active users, Mac has two, Doom has about ten, and Genealogy doesn't seem to have any. The current Featured Wiki, Radio Control, was abandoned, and now has one active user.

It looks like there's Star Wars as the most active Wikicity, and then there's Muppet Wiki, and then nobody else really comes close.

I would suggest that the people at Wikicities look at the way we run things at Muppet Wiki with an open mind. Our approach seems to be working better than almost anything else here. It's possible that the principles that you've inherited from Wikipedia don't apply to small niche wikis.

I think it would be fun to have a meeting on the IRC, with the Wikicities staff and our four admins, to talk about how Muppet Wiki could be used as a model for how to run a successful wiki. If you think that's a good idea, please let me know! -- Danny Toughpigs 17:14, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

I feel compelled to mention the major effect on wiki's level of use is bound to be from their topics. For the record, I was one of the anonymous ones drawn to Muppet Wiki by the topic, but I made a handful of edits and the tone of the "Hi, how about getting a user name" message drove me away. -- Sine 22:11, 23 March 2006 (UTC)
Hi Danny! Firstly, I was actually aware that Muppet was one of the most successful Wikicities - indeed, as I mentioned, that was why I was trying to improve the front page in the first place! Referring specifically to the front page edits, I was thinking more of it improving the site for casual visitors than editors - people make a first impression of a website at the second they arrive, and I didn't want to risk them thinking that it wasn't worth their time looking around. :-)
As Sine says, the topic of the wiki is a major factor in its success. I would tend to say that growth to the capacity of the associated community and its culture base is inevitable once given a good start. The Creatures community had many thousands in its day, but that was six years ago and it is strictly limited in size now - therefore, there are limits to the size and popularity of its associated wiki. However, that is clearly not the only factor. More important is what you put on the pages.
Fan encyclopedias are essentially about culture. The Creatures Wiki it is only as big as it is due to the large number of breeds, addons (COBs) and websites that have articles about them. Of course, there is not a lot to be said for some of them, and so the mean page size is smaller. Muppet's are even smaller (or were in January - it may have changed since then, but the mean doesn't tend to change by much), most likely due to the large number of episodes, characters, stories and the like that have articles. This is one reason to be wary of article count as a measure of success - one month ago Muppet Wiki was 2.6Mb in size, while WikiFur was 3.5Mb. Conversely, Star Wars was 21Mb. Even if Muppet Wiki has doubled in size over the past month (which is possible, and cool if true), it is a bit of a stretch to put it in a class of its own.
Wikis are always very busy when they first start out, but they tend to get slower as convenient sources of information are "used up". I have a feeling that a large part of the Muppet Wiki's overnight success in terms of size is the great number of sources that are already available in a database-like format. You do have quite a few people, but it seems like the majority of the edits are coming from several high-volume editors. I know from my work on the Creatures Wiki that it is a lot easier to write about something if you already have a large set of facts about it available. The Things you can do page is a good example of leveraging existing resources to create content. We don't have that luxury - there is a published Encyclopedia Fragglia, and other published sources of information collected over the course of the 50 years that the Muppets have been around, but there's no such Encyclopedia Furry yet - we like to think we're writing it!
Sine here is a good example of why I feel that the policy of blocking contributors who have little interest in participating socially is an incorrect one. Sine made over 200 edits before creating an account, many of them entirely new articles. This sort of situation does not occur all that much, but it does happen, enough that 18% of our edits come from anonymous users. Conversely, we've found that many of those who make accounts only post for a short amount of time (often once about themselves) and then disappear. I agree that a level of community is helpful and probably even necessary for a successful wiki project. However, I don't think that you need to exclude those that don't want to be a part of that community unless they are actively harming it.
You're welcome to join us in #wikicities - I'm surprised that there are not more people from Muppet in there given its popularity. If you want to talk to the Wikia staff then it would probably be the best place. I'm sure they'd be interested in discussing things with you, though I don't know that there's really a time when everyone's guaranteed to be around - I know Angela and Tim are in Australia, which can make coordination a bit tricky. Also, have you considered presenting your theories of wiki management at WikiMania? Community wikis are something that I think would be an interesting topic to discuss there. --GreenReaper(talk) 03:09, 24 March 2006 (UTC):::
Hi! Andrew from Muppet Wiki here, weighing in. To quote you, Laurence: Sine here is a good example of why I feel that the policy of blocking contributors who have little interest in participating socially is an incorrect one. That's a bit of a misunderstanding, which I think your comment about real names on Muppet Wiki also shows. Registering and participating socially aren't the same thing. While we like to know people's real names (I know it makes it easier to treat users as people and not floating entities, and I feel I've made friends with folks like Danny and Scott and Brad and other Muppet Wiki regulars, which might have happened anyway but it's easier than if I knew them only as "FlyingSaucerhead666777LOL" or what have you. The real name is not a policy, just a strong suggestion, and it lets us put them on a community portal. Several new users have registered but not responded to messages. However, they're making clearly useful edits, and the username allows them and us to see what a help they've been. If they want to talk with us, that would be nice, but there's no penalty against it. Also, Sine, when did you visit us? The username thing has only been around for a month, and is still being tested. I apologize if it seemed too harsh to you, but I'm hoping you're beginning to see that there's method to our madness. There's four admins, all of whom have fulltime jobs or school outside of the Wiki, and the policy was developed after a rash of anonymous, truculent users and spammers were basically wasting all of our time, and I know I myself have been extremely stressed out about it. Is letting every anonymous user basically screw about and trying to revert them, sometimes five times in a row (for things which are akin to vandalism, but not outright spamming, i.e. inserting one opinionated sentence over and over), important enough to sacrifice our own mental health and energy? Softening the text has been suggested before, and I'm certainly willing to listen. --Andrew, Aleal 03:31, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Here’s a few facts about our “exclusion.” (Warning, this is lengthy, but useufl I think) Of approximately 68 blocked Ips to date (generally spammers and trolls posting obscenities about Elmo, Kofi Annan, or Elton John), only 25 have been blocked with the User Name policy states as a reason. Of those, three were the same person, who kept making odd edits about Cookie Monster being an obscene reference. Two were the same IP for a person who kept posting odd messages which could be summarized as “Its stupid for Pigs in Space to have Swedish Chef as an alien and I’ll keep adding my opinion until I die”. Two IPS were a chap who apparently had a grudge against an obscure character.
  • One contributed demonstrably false information repeatedly,
  • One was the same as a previously registered user who had been blocked for amongst other things sending a barage of near-harassment e-mails to an admin
  • One kept switching questionable dates and refused to respond to our queries to him,
  • One basically acted like a jerk on pages (basically saying info was wrong and insisting he was right, but as he “wasn’t a joiner,” he refused to give any indication of what his source was except a general “trust me”),
  • One was actually a vandal (changing descriptions of Caroll Spinney to “the bird man”) but we gave him a username message anyway with its accompanying e-mail address if he wanted to play nice,

one did post some useful stuff but with a lot of NPOV (and again, refused to answer queries or suggestions about editing etiquette),

  • One made really strange comparisons which all had to be reverted
  • One created a page full of speculation and false info about a not yet released DVD (and when it was removed to a talk page, kept changing the same info on the talk page),
  • One kept editing a page to state how annoying another minor character was, another posted some useful info but also an obsessively long and irrelevant history of “Wheel of Fortune”,
  • One was yet another random unexplained date changer.
I think I'm missing a couple more same IP situations, but basically, that accounts for 16 out of 25. Of the remainder, one was an accidental block which was reverted. So that leaves 8 people who were excluded (mostly folks just adding a period). It is kind of a shame, yes, but they can e-mail to get back in, and like I said, this is all an experiment (and a few of those basically linked to pages that didn't exist and in general didn't understand how a Wiki worked and showed no interest in learning). Though the policy claimes there's a five anonymous edit trial period, in many cases we've let them slide for up to ten or more, depending on the kind of edits they make. If other Wikicities folks are put off by the policy and don't join, that's also a shame but really, there's no point in worrying about people who choose not to participate for one reason or another, on the off chance that one is a long lost Muppet genius or truly brilliant writer who also likes Muppets. For the record, we've also unblocked two more users fairly recently, after questions were raised, to see if they come back and give them more time, as their edits were either useful or questionable (random name reordering) but not outright falsifying or vandalism,
Finally, one more note on the policy. Yes, we have a community, and we invite others to participate in it. But there's a difference between "forcing socialization" and expecting basic etiquette, respect, and really just simple communication. There's one anonymous editor who has posted to talk pages, giving a name but not choosing to register, and really doing some useful work, though he only pops in twice a month or so. We haven't blocked him, though we've encouraged him to register, and I doubt we will. Why? Because he's read the FAQ, reads talk pages, in general is aware of what we're trying to accomplish with certain larger projects rather than just blanking or changing things to fit his own view and ignoring what all other editors do, causing edit wars. Apart from the "trust me" guy, not one of the blocked users I've listed ever responded to any direct friendly greetings, questions, or warnings. --Andrew, Aleal 04:02, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Hi there Andrew - thanks for chiming in with your reasoning, and the more detailed analysis of who and what has been affected. I think the idea of a lone muppet genius is suitable for a special muppet in and of itself. I can just imagine them with lots of scraggly thread-hair and a nervous tic. :-)
I guess the nickname issue is just a difference of opinion and usage - one which I've noticed before in one other community. I've never had a problem making friends with people using only nicknames. Indeed, I know most of my friends by them, and I'd find it less convenient otherwise due to lack of distinctiveness (I'm pretty sure I know at least three Andrews online, for example, not counting yourself). Certainly in the furry fandom there are few people who do not have and use nicknames, both online and - in many cases - in real life.
I appreciate that you need methods of keeping counterproductive behaviour under control. I just don't see how the chosen solution solves your problem without causing needless tension. We ban bad editors as well, for various reasons, but quite a few of our most troublesome edits have come from people who have taken the time to register. The bad people are still likely to make edits, and the clever bad ones will realise that they can do so more easily with a username. Worse, it's quite possible to make multiple accounts on one IP and thus make it less clear who is agreeing or disagreeing with who.
As for the user who keeps inserting the same sentance over and over again, or the date-switchers - no, if it's a problem then you should deal with it, as with the other cases you describe. But I don't see why you can't do so under policies that make it clear that you will ban them for that, not for being unregistered users. You seem to be attacking the symptom, and not the cause. If the flood of edits is too much for four people to deal with (and I can understand how that would be, particularly after Something Awful paid us a visit last August), I would suggest you need to find more people from within your own ranks who you can trust with admin powers. We have more - not all of them are around all the time, but enough to make me worry less about working late and not being able to look in once in a while. :-)
Oh, and MediaWiki also has a feature for "monitoring" edits and flagging unmonitored ones in Recent changes. You might want to ask the Wikia team about the possibility of turning that back on for Muppet Wiki, so that you only need one admin checking each edit. --GreenReaper(talk) 04:42, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Laurence, I'm a little surprised by the way you're interpreting the facts. You said that our wiki was "less successful" because of our policies, but I'm finding it hard to pin down what your measure for success is. I'm pointing out that our article count, number of active contributors, number of edits and database size is larger than any other Wikicity except for one. In response, you suggest that the defining factor is our mean page size. I would say that's a little unfair, and I think at this point you're deliberately trying to find fault with Muppet Wiki because you don't agree with our community rules.
The question, really, is whether the Wikipedia-received philosophy that you're working with is open to evidence or not. I think that the Wikipedia rules work very well for Wikipedia, which has thousands of users, but they don't work for smaller niche wikis. I can back that up with the clear evidence of our success. I would hope that you and the other Wikicities admins are at least open to considering that evidence, and thinking about whether the structure that you're promoting is really working or not.
In your response, you were looking at some outdated stats, so here's a link to Muppet Wiki's current stats.
Here's what you said about database size: "This is one reason to be wary of article count as a measure of success - one month ago Muppet Wiki was 2.6Mb in size, while WikiFur was 3.5Mb. Conversely, Star Wars was 21Mb. Even if Muppet Wiki has doubled in size over the past month (which is possible, and cool if true), it is a bit of a stretch to put it in a class of its own."
In fact, if you look at the current stats, Muppet Wiki's database is 6.1Mb. It's more than doubled in size in the past month. In fact, at this rate, it'll be more than twice as big as WikiFur within a few weeks.
It's also interesting to compare the number of contributors. You said that Muppet Wiki has "several high-volume editors" -- in fact, according to the latest stats, we have 11 contributors who have made over 1000 edits. WikiFur only has four contributors who have made that many edits -- and according to your post, many of your contributors sign on, create a page about themselves, and leave. Apparently, Muppet Wiki isn't just better at attracting contributors; we're better at keeping them, too.
It's easy to come up with explanations for why Muppet Wiki is an "overnight success" -- we have a great topic, we tapped into an existing fan community, we're working from existing databases. But really, those are just excuses. I think it's obvious that we're an overnight success because we know how to grow and manage a small, active wiki. I think you ought to consider that maybe somebody else has a really good idea that you could learn something from.
Now, we're not coming here to have a pissing contest with you about whose wiki is bigger, or better. The point is that I care a lot about Wikicities, and I think that the administrators here are making some mistakes in the way that you deal with the people on the wikis. I think that the evidence is right there for you to see. The vast majority of wikis on this site are limping along at best. And, unfortunately, now that you have a new successful wiki here, the only thing you can do is come up with reasons to criticize us.
Here's my final point, and I think it's very revealing about the way that Wikicities administrators are running things. Muppet Wiki has been in operation for close to four months, and in that time, we've become the second most popular wiki here. Let's do the numbers.
Number of Wikicities admins who have come by to complain about our policies, and tell us that we don't know how to run a successful wiki: Three.
Number of Wikicities admins who have come by to say, wow, you guys are really active and successful, it looks like you're doing a nice job: Zero.
You guys talk a lot about supporting healthy, active communities, but nobody from Wikicities has ever said a single nice word about our wiki, in all the time that we've been here. In fact, on this very page, all you can do is come up with reasons to tear us down and make us feel bad. You keep saying that we're excluding people, and not being friendly. Would it kill you to say something nice once in a while? Any of you? -- Danny Toughpigs 05:02, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Andrew: Thinking about it, the problem is not just the people you block; it's the people that you leave messages for who decide never to come back. I noticed in particular the text "it'll help you (and everyone) keep track of your contributions" on the first line. That's your reason for wanting it, and its tone puts me off the idea of registering. Perhaps you need more carrots? There are many good reasons for registering that are totally unconnected with everyone knowing who is doing what. You could make a page like this one explaining in more detail why they should register, and emphasising its speed and nonintrusivity. As I touched on above, an awful lot of things are not written down in the furry fandom, and I wouldn't want to lose the only people who know about them just because they felt pressured to join up or leave. --GreenReaper(talk) 08:41, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for pointing out those updated stats for me. If I had been aware of them, I would probably not have made some of the assertions I made above, as they do paint a clearer picture of your current status. I will have to ask JasonR/Tim how they're doing about getting that integrated with the main system, because I know we all want them. I would note that Google Analytics is also worth installing if you wish to know more about where your visitors are coming from and where they are going.
I do still believe the "excuses" I made for Muppet Wiki's growth are good excuses - or rather, I honestly think that they are major reasons for its growth. The fact that Muppet Wiki has gotten to the point where these factors start to matter and drive the continued growth is the one that I consider to be attributable to Muppet's core leadership. Let me be clear on one thing, if nothing else - I think that it is great that we have another successful wikicity, and without you and your friends it would never have happened. I hope you manage to find the time to enjoy it as well as to run it! Perhaps when the target is reached . . .
If you think that Wikia (who I do not represent) is doing a bad job in terms of community outreach - well, maybe you're right. Ultimately, though, their first job is to make sure that things run smoothly, which is hard enough when you have one wiki to deal with, let alone a thousand. It's all to easy to focus on the problems rather than the good things that are happening. If you want to improve that, then why not hang around in IRC and drop a few links to some of your neater articles as they come up? Maybe we would have a greater appreciation of the highlights of Muppet Wiki if we knew about them.
I checked out the IRC log for last month. We all said the same things I've said recently - that we thought it would discourage casual contributors, and probably wouldn't solve your problem. Was it that surprising that the same people who'd talked about it were concerned to hear that you'd implemented it anyway? Remember, their job is to solve problems, and trust me, it sure sounds like a problem if people are getting banned from a wiki just for not logging in. While the problem you have needs a solution - large numbers of troublesome IP edits that your admin team don't have time to handle - I still think that adding admins is a far better route than to try to eliminate the IPs with a "join up or don't contribute" policy. If you are spending all your time fighting fires then there will be less time to drive other projects, and if you all burn out then there will be nobody to take over.
With all that said - I did start editing at Muppet Wiki a fortnight ago with the specific goal of making the most improvement in the shortest amount of time - about two hours, initially. Ultimately, I did the same thing as the Wikia members of staff - I saw what I considered to be a problem, and I tried to fix it. I made the mistake of not leaving fast enough after that, instead realising that I disagreed with several more things and trying to fix them as well. That was arrogant of me, no doubt, and I apologise for it. I would probably be tempted to do it again, though, so forgive me for not coming over to congratulate you on the new layout! I've already spent over a day more than I intended dealing with this, and my manager is probably wondering what that strange eye logo on my web browser is. :-)
I now think I understand why Wikicities has failed to be the all-embracing happy family of co-contributing wikis that was originally envisioned. For a wiki to succeed, it must have a strong leadership team with a clear vision that can build a community. It is hard enough to find that, but it is even harder to get such teams to work together (because they all have to believe they have good ideas, and want to implement them, otherwise they wouldn't have gone to the considerable trouble of properly founding a wiki). Even when they do join forces, they don't have the time to give the group project their full attention due to prior commitments to their own projects.
As for contributing to each other's wikis . . . well, in at least one case that hasn't worked out quite as intended, has it? :-) I suspect that if the person concerned is that interested enough to take time off from other projects to gain contributor status and join another wiki's culture, then they'd probably already have founded it. We have many separate wikicities now, but "separate" is the key word. There are fifty internal links to every one interwiki link . . . and almost all of them are between the four different languages of Memory Alpha.
I think the concept of wikicitizens who travel freely between wikis is inherently flawed - no-one can truly be a member of every wikicity, just as nobody can have citizenship in more than a few countries. It is a shame, but I don't really see a way around it. At least the GFDL is in place, so the best wiki syntax ideas can be copied from one wiki to another, but it's harder to copy culture piecemeal. I don't really want to have to wait until I decide to move on and start again to try things, though, so I'll have a look at what you've done (particularly in the area of making talk pages more discoverable, which would probably help here) and maybe try implementing similar things here and see how they go. Fair deal? --GreenReaper(talk) 08:41, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
I'm afraid you've lost me completely. People we leave messages for who decide never to come back? I have no idea what Sine's situation was, but in keeping track of patterns in both editing and our responses to them, I've yet to see an occasion where we post a welcome and then that person leaves. Whether to make useful edits or to post nonsense, they stick around. A registration page might not hurt, but I also don't see what's wrong about suggesting users might find the watchlist useful, and that if other editors can see what they're doing, they can assist, congratulate, and generally pitch in. As I've said several times before, I understand the concern about our policies but only if you think they'll set a nasty precedent. Like I keep saying, it's an experiment born from necessity. And it *has* cut down on fires. The biggest fires stressing me out right now are these sort of discussions, which keep pulling me and the others away from fun projects (such as seeing how many American states we can create pages for with in terms of their Muppet context, from filming locations and references to birth places) has me incredibly stressed. We greet people and try to be as friendly as possible. I make a point of putting a specific compliment or suggestion to almost every anonymous user I can. You mentioned our way of banning those who repeatedly add nonsense sentences, not saying we shouldn't ban them, but that we shouldn't bring up the username policy? When that happens, as opposed to outright vandals, we *always* include an e-mail address where they can explain what they were trying to do if they're genuinely clueless or good natured but a bit confused. Basically, we're giving those people a greater benefit of the doubt. Anyway, I'm tired of this whole thing which started when you redesigned our page without even so much as "Hi!" and then complained about how we were voting about it. I respect your position as admin, but please, respect ours and what we're trying to do, which you admit you have no real interest in and have generally given an impression of not really having looked at the Wiki outside of the design page and the discussions related to it.
I would like to reiterate that a) we're not forcing people to socialize, b) we don't block people just for not registering, we block them for not communicating in anyway; they can be unsigned in but communicate, or they can register and be silent, but those who do both have by editing patterns proven to be counterproductive, as we just have to keep reverting them 5 or 10 times in a row; c) the real name thing is *not* a policy, and we have at least four or five active contributors I can think of right now, plus some new ones, who register but don't want their real name on the Wiki and we respect that (and it should be noted that just today, Sesame Street writer/composer Christopher Cerf, who was part of the show from the beginning through the 90s, registered under his real name, edited and *explained* each edit, and generally has been friendly and correcting far more misinformation and adding more good stuff in just three posts than this mythical anonymous user who won't even say hi or register or anything but knows more than anyone else about Muppets).
This has been an experiment, and in fact we've had to date at least 8 to ten users, whether they stick around for long or not, who registered as a direct response to the Username policy, having had enough time to play around and see what we're doing. If we can see that it's not working, we'll try something else. Anyway, all the best to you. It's not worth my losing any more sleep over this matter. How about we agree to disagree and stay in our own spheres, until/unless anyone within Muppet Wiki, anonymous or registered, complains about how we run things, or how we choose to design our main page? :) --Andrew, Aleal 11:08, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Laurence, I'm glad to hear that you'll take another look at Muppet Wiki. That's really all that I'd ask, for people to just look around and see how it's going. When you do that, if you have any thoughts or questions about anything, feel free to post on my page and ask me about it.
I absolutely understand that people don't have time to be a real contributing part of the other wikis -- everybody's busy working on their own, or at least we should be! I just have one suggestion, which I'll offer to you and all of the Wikicities admins.
I think it would be a good idea if some of the Wikicities admins made it a practice to visit other wikis once in a while, and say something encouraging. If you only come in to "fix a problem", then you're going to get a bad response, especially if the community doesn't perceive it to be a problem. On the other hand, everybody appreciates a compliment. It's one of the basic principles of how to give feedback -- you say something nice first, before you say something critical. Giving encouragement helps people to trust you, and like you, and then you earn the right to criticize.
So this is my proposal for any Wikicities admin who feels like doing it: Every once in a while -- maybe once a week -- pick a wiki to visit. It could be an active one, or a struggling one. Look at the recent changes list, and click on a couple of articles that look interesting. Try to get a sense of what the community is working on at the moment.
Then just post something nice. It could be on the talk page of a well-written article, or the user page for the person who wrote it, or an admin's user page. Just say, "Hey, that's a neat article. I didn't know that (pick an interesting fact). Looks like you guys are doing a good job on this wiki. If there's anything I can help you with, let me know."
That whole thing could take about half an hour. I think if you guys are spending time chatting on the IRC, then you probably have half an hour once a week to go pick a wiki and poke around on it. It would probably even energize you and keep you focused on why Wikicities is a good place -- you'll get to visit a bunch of other "countries", and maybe learn something that you didn't know before. Now that I think about it, it sounds like fun to me too, so maybe I'll start doing it myself.
Anyway, the point is that it would create a nice feeling of community among all the disparate wikis here. We don't have to be contributors on each other's wikis, but it would be nice if we were friendly colleagues. It would also build trust between a wiki's leadership team and the Wikicities admins -- so when an actual problem comes up, they'll appreciate your help.
So I hope that's helpful. As heated as this conversation has gotten in places, I'm glad that we've had the chance to talk about this stuff. -- Danny Toughpigs 14:47, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Andrew: Seems fine with me. I'm sure that if changes in your policies or guidelines appear to be necessary, your own users will suggest them in time. I shouldn't have tried to speed up the process by (e.g.) importing voting process ideas from Wikipedia, since as you say, it's a different place, and I was personally involved with the outcome of the vote.
Danny: That's a good idea, and what you say makes sense. I will suggest it to the Wikia admins and the other Wikicities founders that I'm friends with. I know they've been watching; I directed them here when it became clear that it was an issue with wider relevance.
The more I think about it, the more the "Wikicountries" idea seems more relevant. Countries often have heated disagreements about how other countries do things, often rooted in a lack of understanding about why things are that way due to inexperience with foreign culture or situations. Some sort of "cultural exchange" program like you suggest does seem appropriate. I think the Featured Wikicity program was partly an attempt at that, but it's not specifically targeted for that problem, and it relies on people from the wiki concerned coming out and explaining what's cool rather than others going in and understanding it for themselves (enough to write about it, say). We need both.
I have to go to work now, so I'll be brief. Good luck with your projects, and let's hope we never have to go to war. I hate to think of what it would do to the FPS crew to have to choose sides. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:13, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
I think another possible metaphor is federalism, which is the way things work in the US. There's an overarching "national" structure (Wikicities), and then each wiki is a state, or a (wiki)city.
There's some "national" laws that apply to all the wikis -- we don't harass or insult people, we assume good faith, we don't violate copyright. If we want to be accepted as part of this country, then we need to abide by the federal laws.
And then within that national structure, there's room for a state to make its own laws, based on things that only affect that state. In the US, states can make their own laws about school funding, or abortion, or the death penalty. The federal government only gets involved if you cross state lines, or if a case gets appealed up to federal court.
So for us here on Wikicities, individual wikis get to set their own policies, and run things the way that they want to. Some wikis are run well, and they prosper. Others are run badly, and they stagnate. You might like the way they run things on a particular wiki, or not, but that's federalism for you. Ultimately, a wiki can be judged on its own terms -- by how well it's performing, and how happy the people are.
So you don't have to worry about a "war", there's no chance of that. It would be like Massachusetts declaring war on Connecticut. You might think, man, the people in Montana just don't have a clue, but that's a problem for the citizens of Montana to figure out.
The wikis don't have to compete with each other. We're all part of the same project, and in the big picture, we're all working together to make the United States of Wikicities stronger and better. -- Danny Toughpigs 16:21, 24 March 2006 (UTC)
Hmm. States going to war over ideological issues - you mean like this? :-) But yes, I get your point. I think that the only real "wars" that have or will occur are between wikicities and other web communities that hold an opposing point of view. Most wiki editors understand the relative ease of defending the home turf from having done so before, so they're unlikely to bother going on the offensive even if they're firmly opposed to another wiki (e.g. NRA Forever vs Gun Control Wiki), but we've had a few experiences with forums and LiveJournal communities that were less than pleasant.
Now all we need is a national motto! Maybe we could steal "United in diversity" . . . --GreenReaper(talk) 18:08, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Thank You[edit]

Hi there, Ransom, and welcome to WikiFur! Thanks for your contributions so far - let me know if you need any help not already provided. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:17, 24 March 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the warm welcome. I spend most of my time just drawing, so it's been a while since I put my writing skills to any use, but I'm looking to polish the rust off. WikiFur is a really interesting concept. Someone's already written a little blurb about me, which is pretty slick, and I intend to write more about others I know.

Thanks again, and take it easy.


Hi there![edit]

Wow... I had not realized that wiki's could be this...complicated. :D

Thanks for the message, hopefully I won't do anything too complicated to need help with. I'll let ya know if something comes up.

I don't know if it is good or bad that the High Tail Hall page is one of the more popular ones. All I know is that I have information on it, from a forum, and that I will take it upon myself to translate it here. If people ask you about it, I guess you could always send 'em my way. Maybe I should make an account, eh?

EDIT: Made an account, I'm under the name Axel now.

Hello, guys[edit]

I'm new here, just wanted to say hi. I was going to make an article about the Vinci & Arty comics because I talk with the creators regularly. However, the main site of wikipedia claimed it a non notable comic. :( I've decided to come to you guys to see if I can fix up your own page on it. Vidyaranya 06:34, 5 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi there, Vidyarana, and welcome to WikiFur! I'm sorry that you're having trouble on Wikipedia - it is true that they have fairly strict notability guidelines that many comics will not pass. For what it's worth, WikiFur's article was also deleted once - only after we had a few thousand pages and a significant presence did the article stick. You are certainly welcome to improve the Vinci & Arty article that we have, perhaps including some of the material you used in the Wikipedia article. Maybe at a later date they will be more receptive to having an article on the comic, especially one that has been fully developed here first. --GreenReaper(talk) 06:57, 5 April 2006 (UTC)
Don't feel too bad - it was necessary to explain to them just who Fred Patten was when his page first went up. Nobody, even the WikiEditors is necessary aware of everything of significance. --Yealurowluro 18:02, 5 April 2006 (PDT)

This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 6 April to 22 July 2006. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

Hi you ...[edit]

Thanks for your welcome! I only joined 'cause somebody made a wiki page about me ... and in some kind it was wrong. x_x; So that's all.

--Meeko 01:40, 25 Mai 2006 (UTC)

Hi, GreenReaper[edit]

This is partly a test to see if I've got this editor figured out before I do anything important with it. I notice someone put in an entry for yours truly (in fact that's how I wandered in - I was checking old Other Suns links which led to Nicolai's entry which led to mine) which I may update later; at least I suppose the fact that I was Den Mother of ConFurence for years and am now holding that position in CaliFur is at interesting as anything already there. Also an excuse for putting in a few Ursa Major links inasmuch as I maintain the Recommended List.

Speaking of which, I got your note suggesting the addition of WikiFur to the Recommended Anthropomorphics list for this year - makes sense, though I'll have to discuss where to put it with the rest of the committee. We're currently counting nominations for this year's Ursa Major ballot. --Yealurowluro 00:58, 6 April 2006 (UTC)

Glad you got my note! I wasn't entirely sure if I should suggest it myself, but I figured it's something that's worth reading. :-)
It looks like you have the wiki editing figured out. Please do contribute to any articles you find lacking, and good luck figuring out those nominations. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:04, 5 April 2006 (PDT)

Moving assistance.[edit]

Hey GreenReaper,

Thanks for the help moving the page for my listing. I was woundering if it should have been moved over as you did, but didn't have time IRL to send a message. The dire warning kinda steared me off. (I figured I would mess around with my own page before messing up some one elses =)

No problem! A lot of people start off in the User: namespace, as that's where you would normally do it on (e.g.) Wikipedia.

Let me know if I'm misplacing anyother articles so we can keep the database as consistant as possable! (Or if you have any other suggestions)

I'm sure I or another contributor will let you know should that be the case. :-)

I hope the format of the post is accaptable. I wrote the thing in third person as if I was writing about someone else. Thanks again - PG

That was fine. Feel free to edit your User: page if you want to say something from first-person persepective in addition to that which is already there (but don't feel you have to - most people are just fine with what's on the page about them already). --GreenReaper(talk) 03:02, 7 April 2006 (UTC)


Thank you for the kind welcome. Though I've been active on Wikipedia forever (and I'm admin there), I've only just discovered wikifur today. I'm happy to help out in any area that needs it, and I've already added stubs for Wild Life and Wildlifers! Andrew Lenahan - Starblind 15:43, 7 April 2006 (PDT)

Excellent . . . *scoops up some cover pics for those* --GreenReaper(talk) 23:27, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Questions about Des Lee?[edit]

Hey there! Thought I'd drop a line and see if I could answer any questions you might have about Desiree. I set up a basic entry for her awhile ago, but I'd noticed you had a question or two concerning her on my page. Anyway, if I can be of assistance, let me know! Thanks!

Note my recent edit and comment on the talk page, but I'll carry over here and say that I think the question was about those quote-marks around "friend". -- Siege(talk) 20:30, 22 April 2006 (UTC)
Yep, replied on the talk page. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:24, 22 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the Welcome![edit]

I was figuring it would come at some point or another. Very much appreciated. :) Bastique 13:00, 27 April 2006 (UTC)

Hi Back.[edit]

This is a bit awkward, but I think this is the right way to do it. I'm looking over a variety of articles to see what I can add to. I lengthened Ken Fletcher's piece a little -- he deserves more, but it's hard to do him justice, even knowing him fairly well. (Ken is modest to the point of humility.) Kevin Duane's piece broke me up. I could add 10,000 words, but wouldn't know where to start. And do I want to make him out a clown, a villain, a well-intentioned schlemiel, or just a guy who got a lot of bad breaks? Then there was Steve Martin. Another perplexing case. I had to add a bit more detail to the "controversy" section, that put the customs debacle in a somewhat better light.

Ah... I wonder what other delights await? --Taral Wayne

It can be hard. Pages can and have been written about past disputes, but in the end the actual situation can usually be boiled down to just a few paragraphs written in a fairly dry tone. If in doubt, just add the facts, and try to make sure you don't leave out any facts in a way that could be viewed as biased by not giving reasonable coverage of all sides of the story. If you think you're up to writing a more lengthy piece, and you think it is appropriate for the article concerned, be bold and do so. Wikipedia has lots of advice on how to go about this.
Whatever you do decide to add, thank you for taking the time to do so. WikiFur relies on the contributions of those who know the full history of events, and in many cases there are only a few people in the world who do. Hopefully this project will go some way towards ensuring that the history of the fandom doesn't fade away, as I think that would be a shame.
Oh, and note that you can sign comments on talk pages with ~~~~, or just ~~~ if you want to do it without the date. There's no need to do so on the main article pages, as they're intended to be community work anyway (and a full history of contributions is kept in the history tab if it's required). --GreenReaper(talk) 10:02, 30 April 2006 (UTC)
I think I'll just leave the Kevin Duane item as it is. While there's a hundred times more, it isn't really that important, and what's there is probably impartial enough. Though I doubt very much Kevin would own up to much on the negative side of the ledger.
By the way, what would keep him from editing out everything he didn't like, and painting a glowing picture of himself?
Nothing. However, he'd probably find such edits mysteriously changed back a few minutes later. Some people around here tend to watch recent changes like a hawk and can very quickly pick up on editors who are trying to modify history, especially their own. There are established procedures for requesting the removal of certain items of personal information. Blanking or removing information without comment do not count, and won't have the desired effect. --GreenReaper(talk) 10:20, 30 April 2006 (UTC)


Hi, thanks for the welcome! I just have to say that I'm very impressed by the speed at which the articles are updated :)

--MrZebra 10:16, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Glad you like it! We aim to please. ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 10:20, 30 April 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the assistance[edit]

Thank you for loading a higher-resolution picture for me. I appreciate that. And thanks for the welcome as well. :)



Thank you for your barnstar award, I appreciate your recognition. I have found in recent weeks just how difficult it is to start a Wika, and it's always nice to have someone appreciate the work. While I still need to read up on the goals and concept of this Wiki, I'm a big comic book fan and can hopefully help with some new content. You can contact me at my talk page at The O.C. Wikia. - Xtreme680 09:33, 6 May 2006 (UTC)


I'm reasonably sure that this is actually correct, if badly formatted and perhaps not completely relevant to this wiki. See here for the rhyme. --GreenReaper(talk) 18:45, 10 May 2006 (UTC)

I did get a indeed get a positive hit for the rhyme, but Google turned up nothing relevant for Lanelet, Elidia, Zaikhoeven, or "Duncan Frasier" and "Robert Lambe". I tried several different spelling variants and still came up with nothing. Now, I'm willing to grant that Google is not actually the sum of all knowledge, but the lack of hits and the near-unreadability of the edit makes me suspicious. ----DuncanDaHusky(talk) 18:55, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
Duncan Frasier is cited as the author of the rhyme in the above link. Robert Lambe is likely to be this guy.
There does seem to be some confusion in online sources about who wrote the item and when it was written. Don't suppose you know any medieval historians? :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 19:10, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
I've done some further research and I think I see the problem: it's written in the arcane and byzantine languange of academese, a language I'm afraid I lost my fluency in years ago (and besides, I only ever spoke technical academese - I think it relates to Liberal Arts academese like Classical Latin to Vulgate Latin :-) I'll warrant that it was a valid edit, but written so impenetrably I would question its value. I've found a couple of useful links that might help; I'll probably poke at it a bit more tonight.----DuncanDaHusky(talk) 19:17, 10 May 2006 (UTC)
1. I am able to translate this. It's pretty much just a load of academic-paper-filling bull, and says very little of relevancy to our wiki.
2. Here, lemme take a whack at rebuilding that section.
-- Siege(talk) 23:32, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Thank you[edit]

Thank you for fixing my first upload :D I just joined and I'm still trying to get used to it all. I hope I atleast put THIS post in the correct place.

*grins* - yep, you just need to sign it! You can use ~~~~ to do that (or ~~~ if you don't want to put the date). --GreenReaper(talk) 05:16, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Thank you![edit]

Heya GreenReaper!!

The page looks great, hun! Thanks for editing it a bit for me! There are also more WikiFur pages about me including Xelaros and Spirit Creations. I see that you guys don't have a page up for Maned Wolves which I would like to create. Thanks for your help! Give me suggestions any time!

Inali Ke'aloha


"Girl's amateur use of makeup by applying too much and her voice make are evidence she is a teenager below the age of eighteen." That wasn't meant as personal, though. It was more a Sherlock Holmes style detective work. I just want to be clear it was not my intention. I probably wrote it wrong. SleepAtWork 14:10, 21 May 2006 (UTC)

It just seemed . . . well, like something you'd post on LiveJournal rather than in an encyclopedia, in much the same way as you get anti-furries taking pictures of fat people at cons and going "hey, look, aren't furries fat!" - maybe that wasn't your intention, but it was the vibe I got from your words. Her own words make her look bad enough as it is without pointing out her use of makeup.
A secondary consideration is that page is intended to be just a list of links rather than an in-depth discussion of them. If you really want to write up the details (which would probably include details from both videos), you could make an article on it and then link to it, as with the other articles linked from the media links page. --GreenReaper(talk) 18:10, 21 May 2006 (UTC)
Hmmm... you have an odd idea of copying the threads of talk and putting it on both talk pages. Well back to the topic, I also forgot the eyebrows were unplucked (I just wanted to write that down somewhere) as giving evidence that she was a minor. I think I'll put likely minor in the article. Umm.. I don't know if it's worthy of an article itself. It mostly is just a webcam video and then speaking of the vanity fair article. It would be different if it went through the things produced by actual furries, like her reaction to furry pornography art, but I think the video looks like little effort was put into it, and the humor was mostly the behavior of the girl herself. Encyclopedia Dramatica and some of the TV spots for instance do put some effort into their work. SleepAtWork 15:16, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
I can just see that sequel: "Valley Girl, Furry Porn". Nuts and berries, indeed!
I actually think there's an opportunity to do a good video on furries and put it up there. The question would be whether or not anyone would go around with a videocamera at (say) Anthrocon and film it, and whether or not people would agree to its distribution. Maybe if it was done by someone already respected in the community.
Speaking for Anthrocon, I can tell you that our Rules of Conduct prohibit "broadcasting" of any video taken at the convention, which includes posting it online. --Giza 19:25, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
. . . without permission. I was thinking of one that would be done with permission. --GreenReaper(talk) 19:44, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Based on my experience, furries at cons get very nervous when there is a camera rolling, due to past bad experiences. I wouldn't recommend holding your breath on getting permission to broadcast anything that's filmed.  :-/ --Giza 19:54, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Alas! On that general topic, it might be nice to do some kind of "WikiFur Documentary" thing. Maybe we could start with topics like "acting out in fursuit" or "making your first tail" and work up to tricky topics like "attending a furry convention". :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 19:59, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
Do you mean having documentation here on WikiFur, or elsewhere? If it's here on WikiFur, would such an article still be considered "encyclopedic"? --Giza 21:01, 25 May 2006 (UTC)
I believe that there is certainly room on WikiFur for material that is created by a particular person or group of people, something like "RandomVulpine's guide to making furry feet". Some use their own websites for such material, but if people want to put them up on WikiFur then I think we should be open to that. These should naturally be clearly tagged with a template similar to the current personal articles one, and should be placed in the User: namespace, or possibly a separate namespace designed for the purpose - Tutorial:, say. They could be linked to from regular articles, though it might be good to make a separately-headed section for them to separate them from the regular links that you'd get in See also.
I tend to copy talk because it's easier for other people to follow that way. I also archive my talk now and then, which makes it harder for people trying to follow the other side of conversation. --GreenReaper(talk) 18:55, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

Off subject, when the game Spore comes out (a design evolution), I expect it may have something for furry gaming. SleepAtWork 15:18, 25 May 2006 (UTC)

I agree, though Second Life seems to have grabbing most of the virtual furry world for now. --GreenReaper(talk) 18:55, 25 May 2006 (UTC)


Hey there! Thanks for the warm greet. I didn't exactly get to finish last night due to work issues, AND the fact I wasn't completely sure what I was doing (lol) Looks like someone was kind enough to get the basics started for me anyway :-)

As I learn a little more, I'd really like to be more active in the Wiki community so hopefully you'll see a little more of me ;-)

Regards -=Wulfsige=-


Thanks man, this is the best Wiki EVER! - MegaKitsune


' I guess you found your way here from the creatures wiki'

Sort of, pretty long story. I think I found them both at relatively the same time, when I started using wikipedia.

Thanks for the friendly welcomes! --Listeel 14:32, 30 May 2006 (UTC)


Well, I've finished both the Extinctioners page and the individual character pages but some of them have a clean up not at the top, how can you clean up what little (in some cases) is there? --RVDDP2501

Perhaps they were referring to the manner in which the text was phrased? For example, it might have been written in first-person, when third-person is more appropriate for an encyclopedia. It might also be that formatting was non-standard or that the article was not correctly categorized (we really need to get specific templates for these, right now cleanup is used for everything). You can always ask the person who put the tag on the article what their precise reasoning was. --GreenReaper(talk) 00:42, 7 June 2006 (UTC)


Good timezone. The forums are all set up and ready to go. Let me know if you want help changing anything. I added a help page but it's a bit basic at the moment, because I'm still figuring out how things work and what we need to know! It will be good to see how it goes. Later -- sannse (talk) 13:41, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

Hey, man[edit]

Thanks for the welcome and comments. I got tagged for cleanup for my article, but I'm not exactly sure where I should start looking to clean it up. Any thoughts? --User:Réizàr

You'd have to ask User:DuncanDaHusky about that, since he tagged it. However, this passage does spring to mind as one example:
His most noticeable feature is the moon-and-star tattoo on the back of his left hand, but when asked for a meaning, the most one can expect of the enigmatic weretiger is a sliht shrug, not out of rudeness, but because he has yet to find an actual meaning for it beyond something he drew one day in a fit of boredom.
It's an encyclopedia article, not a MUCK character description. It could just as easily be something like "His most noticeable feature is the moon-and-star tattoo on the back of his left hand, which has no inherent meaning." There's no call to be mysterious about it. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 23:59, 8 June 2006 (UTC)
Ah, okay. Odd though; that's been there for a while, and I was referring to myself IRL. I'll look it over though, and think of a way to simplify it. Thanks.


That's just an example of something that popped out at me. He might have been looking at at something else. Given the size of WikiFur, not all people will have read all articles, and so they may come across something that they disagree with that they'd also have disagreed with beforehand. They may also have a threshold before they actually do something about it. --GreenReaper(talk) 02:00, 9 June 2006 (UTC)
Yeah, it's pretty big here. I'll skim over it a few more times and ask Duncan what else he thinks needs to be cleaned up. One of these days I'll get it right. Hah.


I've noticed that sometimes the Furpile link goes unupdated, so I've been choosing articles for it. Essentially I've been clicking "Random page" until something suitable turns up. I'm only trying to keep it from going empty, so I won't update it further than a day ahead. So if you want to nominate things you still can. --Rat 04:06, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks! As noted on the page, you can choose as many as you like at once, as long as you don't repeat stuff that's coming up or was recently requested. --GreenReaper(talk) 05:35, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Thanks from the newbie[edit]

I just want to say thanks for correcting my spelling errors and welcoming me on my first page. Very appriciated! ~Kuzzy


I asked you some questions on that wiki. I don't know if you check it often, so I will note it here. SleepAtWork 13:47, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Hmmm you are faster on checking encyclopedia dramatica than here. SleepAtWork 22:20, 10 June 2006 (UTC)

Patience. I get watchlist emails everywhere, I just sometimes don't get around to pressing "Save page" until I have had time to give a proper response. It's only just past breakfast here. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 22:22, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Hmm watchlists can send emails. SleepAtWork 23:10, 10 June 2006 (UTC)
Watchlists can do everything! --GreenReaper(talk) 04:06, 12 June 2006 (UTC)


I forgot your room number already. But I trust that you found my note about the flyers in the meetup page. I even tried looking for you for an hour. That was rather fun. Spot the norn in the furpile. And without a cell number, I couldn't directly contact you.

Anyway. See you at the meetup! ----Markus(talk) 07:49, 16 June 2006 (UTC)

Don't have a cell phone! But yes, we did indeed meetup, so that was OK. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 01:52, 19 June 2006 (UTC)

Brillliant Right![edit] Interesting! Just wanted to see what you guys think.

It's good to see such an authoritative and popular site covering the topic! Shame about the colour scheme, but eh, what can you do? --GreenReaper(talk) 17:20, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
How much of that site did you look at? Not exactly the most flattering portayal of furries. If anything, I'm glad they chose a color scheme that makes it look like an amateur rant. --mwalimu 18:43, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
I was being sarcastic. :-) I guess I should have included the ;-) . . . --GreenReaper(talk) 18:46, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
Hmm, okay. My bad. --mwalimu 19:46, 19 June 2006 (UTC)


Thanks for the warm welcome! ^-^ I thought this was the best way to display our music to the furry community! I'll be sure to ask you if i need help. Thanks again, Ether


Thanks for the great welcome. If there is anything that I can do to help, feel free to ask.



Ghear maidth agus :) thank you for the welcome. I, too, joined since someone created a wiki of me and my fiance. I figured I needed to correct our wikis and make them as unbiased as possible.


Thanks for welcoming me. I myself am a wizard at Frontier Galaxy MUCK so I figured if nothing else, it'd be my duty to correct that that little entry. Though I'm blindly stumbling through Wiki's system presently, glad I'm only editing and not adding articles, need to read a bit more before I try something like that. (And I would if I didn't have homework for a test, heh!) --Autolycus

Well, it's great that you had the time to fix it up - and should you find any more later, feel free to try your hand at making articles yourself. If it looks like you need help I'm sure one of our regular contributors will step in and lend a hand. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 07:01, 25 June 2006 (UTC)


oh, my bad, man. i didn't know. thanks for telling me :) by the way, that article, Wolfie, isn't about me. Wolfie 13:41, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Multiple edits[edit]

I really apologize for all the edits, I'm new to any sort of wiki, so I'm just trying to get it as perfect as possible XD --Nekonaru Letao

It's no real problem. Perfection is an admirable goal to have. :-) Oh, one more tip - you can sign your name on talk pages with ~~~, or ~~~~ to get the date as well. It helps people reading to see who said what! --GreenReaper(talk) 01:50, 29 June 2006 (UTC)

What was the killhamster article here?[edit]

You said: "I would note that the article about "killhamster", whose article was used as a reference, was deleted, twice, for being totally full of nonsense added by himself and his friends."

I referenced his livejournal and the edit dispute in the LJ was talking about on ED. Umm... did he make an article on wikifur? SleepAtWork 09:06, 1 July 2006 (UTC)

Yes. It was at various times a duplicate of User:Killhamster on ED, and/or random nonsense. --GreenReaper(talk) 09:15, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


Hi GreenReaper, thanks forleaving a note on my talk page. Lilim 04:41, 4 July 2006 (UTC)


Thanks for helping me delete the left over pages from the recent vandalism. It's much appreciated :) -- DeVandalizer 23:16, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Seemed like a similar pattern to last time. If it happens again I'll get the staff to do a checkuser to get their IP and see if we can do a range block. --GreenReaper(talk) 23:21, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
Sounds like a good plan. I saw the user page creation in recent changes and I had some inkling something was going to go down -- the pattern was far too similar. -- DeVandalizer 23:28, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

hi hehehehe[edit]

hay there thank you for your intrest come some time later


I just wanted to say thank you for all the help you've provided while I continue to learn how to use the features in here. I'll try my best to keep improving, and hopefully provide more information where I can. =^_^=
Kendareru Neko-sama 16:55, 12 July 2006 (UTC)

Tigerpaw accounts[edit]

Thanks for welcome me. As for the User:TigerPaw thingy probally forgot it. can delete it if you would like.

No problem. I'll set a redirect so it goes to your new account. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:41, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Ok, sounds good to me, probally would have done it myself, but im kinda still learning all the tricks to the wiki stuff.


Thank you for correcting what I submitted and for your welcome. The help section is very useful to submit something ^^ —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Achoral (talkcontribs) .

No problem! In fact Sine did the first part of the work on the article about you. I have done some more work and removed the cleanup tag at the top. Oh, and on talk pages, remember to sign your name with ~~~~ so people know who is talking. Have a nice evening! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 21:04, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

This message has been hidden[edit]

on your talk page at wikipedia by one of their vandalizing admins

I looked here and see no evidence of any changes by this "MONGO" person. --Douglas Muth 14:36, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Hmm... maybe he is referring to this? --Douglas Muth 14:38, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
Yes. And I read that, and I read the deletion, and I read the email he sent. Coming over here was overkill. --GreenReaper(talk) 15:05, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Possible description for outsiders...or something?[edit]

Hi, Green. If you could, please read this little piece I wrote (almost unintentionally) on my user page.

User:Tagenar, the Guide section. It's a sendup of Douglas Adams.

I have enjoyed exploring WikiFur over the last few months, and my experience as a whole is summed up in Guide haha. Maybe it could be used as an official description...or something just to make everyone grin? Either way :-)--Tagenar 16:16, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

Actually, I dropped by when you made the initial edit! It's not really "official" enough to be a description that I think we could use without people getting confused as to whether or not we were a joke site (and besides, I suspect Wikipedia would have quibbles with the definition - they are very clear about what things are part of their Wikimedia Foundation, and we're not), but it was amusing. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:40, 19 July 2006 (UTC)
As long as it was amusing. Even if it's an inside joke, that really was the only intent ;-) Thanks.--Tagenar 17:51, 19 July 2006 (UTC)

This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 22 July 2006 to 9 June 2007. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)

Another Response ;)[edit]

Heya GreenReaper. Thank you for you warm welcome here on thsi Wiki. Its my first, so i guess there will be a few questions once I worked myself through the Style-Code provided here.

Welcome Response September 12, 2006[edit]

Thank you, GreenReaper. I kinda stumbled across this site yesterday and decided to 1. Create an account and 2. Make my page. I was quite flattered to find my name listed in the DJ section of Rainbow Tiger's page, so I got my hooves wet and started a personal page. I'll try to keep it rated PG, but we'll have to see what happens. I'll have a placeholder up for a while with many ... many edits while I figure out the syntax.

Heuvadoches Naumova

Welcome response[edit]

You're welcome! I'll be sure to let you know if I need any help. =^.^= -Alfador

Thanks, GR. -- VederJuda 10:54, 26 September 2006 (UTC)

Response to Welcome[edit]

Just wanna say thanks for the greeting, I'll be sure to ask if I need help with anything ;)

Thanks for greeting me. I had to make my own page look a little spiffier ya know? :D

Thanks for cleaning up after me[edit]

I've been multitasking, so I'm a little scatterbrained at the moment. =^_^!= --Frizzy 05:37, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

And me as well, thanks. Couldn't figure out why I couldn't get those wikipedia links working internally, o,O --Anima 18:24, 7 September 2006 (UTC)

Picture on commons[edit]

Your lecture was very interesting. I have one more picture of you. See:

Fill free to copy it if you want.


Thanks again! I'll do that. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 20:39, 12 August 2006 (UTC)

Featured article[edit]

It's fun to see that my bio is a Featured article now. That means both of my pages have gotten onto the front page. Fox Cutter 21:45, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

I know! This wasn't actually intentional - I only noticed after I featured it. It seemed to be a good pick, so it went up. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 21:52, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Hi there![edit]

Thanks very much pal, if I need any help I know who to turn to now. ^^

- Eric B.

P.S. I'm sorry for posting this as an article, I really don't know how to respond to the comment you gave me. Well, maybe I need your help already. ^^;

And thanks to you.[edit]

I do appreciate the clean-up of my page, and the separation of the book summary. Many thanks! You guys do an amazing job here. - Alicia

You're welcome. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 21:37, 1 September 2006 (UTC)

Well cheers for the welcome![edit]

Just thought I'd drop by and say thanks for the welcome - wasn't expecting that! Been using this site as a resourse for a good while now so I thought it was only right to inflict a little of myself on here.

Werewolf Of London

Hi and thankies[edit]

Hi and thank you for this brill site —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Fox92 (talkcontribs) .

Happy Birthday![edit]

  • 24 wolftytailswat-spankings!* --Chibiabos 03:45, 20 September 2006 (UTC)

Im sorry for the late reply, but thank you for welcoming me[edit]

Im afraid I am not use to this place yet and still have a long way to go on it. But im glad that hospitality is shown here ^_^

From Duragan —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Duragan (talkcontribs) .

All Fur Fun now has official dates![edit]

Hi there! Could you please edit the convention area to show that All Fur Fun will be held March 31 - April 1, 2007? Thanks much! :D

--Teeka 01:11, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Done, and I hope you guys have fun! --GreenReaper(talk) 01:52, 29 September 2006 (UTC)


Hey GreenReaper, thanks for repairing the damage to my page as well as other I may not know about - RVDDP2501 20:26, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

You're welcome! --GreenReaper(talk) 20:30, 29 September 2006 (UTC)

Vandalism War![edit]

A user going by the name of User:Arwel Parry is vandalizing a number of pages right now! I'd reverting edits as fast as I can. Always happy to help! --Tori 11:18, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Fixed vandalism with User:Arcturus --Tori 11:33, 7 October 2006 (UTC)

Where you be on Eye Arr Cee?[edit]

  • cough* Um.. ignore the poor rhyming, just wondering where you is as I've snuck back to the IRC channel the last few days and haven't seen you on at all. o.O --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 20:24, 8 October 2006 (UTC)
...Now I see your note, make it bigger next time. X) --Nidonocu - talk Nidonocu 20:30, 8 October 2006 (UTC)


He! Its me, Carrie, from Anthrocon. I tickled you, remember? And I think I had the pupper fox plushie. :) Whats up?

You can, btw, reach me at

Hi there! I do indeed remember . . . *hides*
I'm doing fairly well - indeed, I just went to another convention last weekend (which I need to actually write about sometime this week). I'll try and contact you when I get back home - still busy at work right now. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 21:39, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Hiya there[edit]

yeah, I found that I had a page to edit and submit info to, and thanks for the help offer. Ill be editing when I can, and look forward to contributing here. :3 —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Zippo (talkcontribs) .

From Buska[edit]

Hi and thanks for the welcome! I tried creating my own page as well. I really need to study the Wiki format a bit more however ^^ —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Buska (talkcontribs) .

RE:Page name correction[edit]

Hey GreenReaper, thanks for the move, I will try not to make mistakes like that in the future - RVDDP2501 00:26, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

No worries. We make them too, sometimes. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 00:29, 20 October 2006 (UTC)

Hey GreenReaper, I was wondering if you could perform another page name edit, could you add an "s" to my Remalon page turning it into "Remalons" (since there are five characters in that page), I would really appreciate it, thank you - RVDDP2501 18:20, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Once again, thanks - RVDDP2501 18:26, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

Extinctioners main page fixing[edit]

Hey GreenReaper, sorry to drop questions on a regular basis but I was wondering if you might know or see a way to modify or re-arrange the list of groups in the Extinctioner's main page, to some how make it appear more neat, thank you - RVDDP2501 18:17, 20 October 2006 (UTC)


Thanks for cleaning up after my messes. :) I'll get the wiki standards hammered through my thick skull eventually!


Thanks for the welcome. X3 Chinmyou 06:06, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

More All Fur Fun stuff![edit]

Hi GreenReaper! All Fur Fun (the new furry convention) has a new website up and running. It's already linked, but I was hoping someone could edit the convention's entry to show that we're a bit more organized now, hehe! I'd do it myself, but I tend to do Very Wrong Things when I try to edit wiki pages, so I'd rather have someone with experience do it. ;D

Thanks in advance! :D

--Teeka 02:36, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Did it last night, but forgot to note that here. If I've missed anything, or if you develop more details over time, do feel free to add it in. --GreenReaper(talk) 23:50, 11 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the offer[edit]

Thanks for the offer, and the cleanup of my page. If it would be at all possible, would you please make my page more wiki friendly? I'm not the best wiki editor. Much Thanks in advance. -- Jaie_Davis

RVDDP2501 character name change request[edit]

Hey GreenReaper, how are you doing, listen, I'm sorry to ask you to do this for me yet again but I need two character's names changed, the characters Slash and Short, I need the last name WhiteEye added to the both of them so they would be e.g. Slash WhiteEye, thanks, I would really appreciate your help with this - RVDDP2501 17:29, 16 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks - RVDDP2501 11:33, 17 November 2006 (UTC)

David E. Klinkler[edit]

It was the least I could do to honor the memory of a fine person and a dedicated Furry (He was a Cheetah because he had

I know all of you furries who knew him must miss him terribly.

I know I still find myself thinking of David from time to time and wish his life had not been taken away so violently and suddenly.

David's death was followed the week after by my Mother's death and the week after that my Grandma passed.

Three loved ones in three never know when they are gonna make sure they know how much you love them...while they are here.

I am not a Furry, but, your members are really great people. Keep the fur flying! —The preceding unsigned comment was added by crobbins (talkcontribs) .

Nice job on the Did You Know section...[edit]

I just wanted to say, nice job on it. I never knew that CSI or any sutch show even knew about the fandom, let alone made episodes with dramatically skewed ideas. (Yiffing parties! :) hmm... whered they hear of those? I'd REALLY like to know... :b ) I wonder, I think theres an episode of law and order with furr... also, nice for ptting it on the front page. cchristian

Glad you like it! We should really update it more frequently. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 23:19, 23 November 2006 (UTC)
Hey, I'd be happy to fill it in for you or do something to help if you gave me some material or something. :) cchristian
Feel free to have a look through Special:Newpages to find some interesting tidbits, then replace the current text and add your new stuff to the archive page. There are other suggestions for ways to help on the Community Central. --GreenReaper(talk) 14:45, 24 November 2006 (UTC)

Image:Kirru sized.png[edit]

Hello GreenReaper,

This is in regards to Image:Kirru sized.png. It has not been tagged with a copyright status. This can be a complicated area, so I can try to help if you need any. The Wikipedia Image use policy may give some background, but it isn't policy here.

To deal with this image, there are a few choices:

  • If you are the copyright holder, release it under a free license, for example:
  • If you are asserting that this image is usable under fair use, add an appropriate fair use tag. A very basic summary is that fair use is used for commentary, criticism and review on the image when no free image could be used instead. Some fair use tags are:
    • Logos: {{logo}}
    • Covers: {{Cover}}
    • Comic panels: {{Comic-panel}}
  • If the image is already under a free license, provide information on the license, and tag the image if you can.
  • If you would like the image to be deleted, ask any administrator

To see a list of current copyright tags available on WikiFur, see Category:Image copyright tags If the copyright status is not resolved, the image may be deleted.

Unless you have a question for me specifically, I'd prefer responses on the page for the image. --Rat 01:27, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome.[edit]

I'm slowly getting myself back onto the net, so this was as good a place to start as any.  :D —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Khromat (talkcontribs) .

Archive Time?[edit]

IMHO, it's time for another User Talk Archive, GR. =3 Spaz Kitty 23:46, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

because I felt like it...[edit]

Newcookie.PNG Congratulations GreenReaper!
You have been awarded with a Furry-Treat for being... small... and uh.. green... yeah............................ .
good job!  ; )

......... - cchristian talk

The Lion King MUCK article[edit]

Excuse the rollback, but your edit to The Lion King MUCK doesn't seem to have been made to the most recent version of the article, and I think it'll be easier to re-do the tables then drift back through edit histories and get the rest of the article restored in bits. -- Sine 06:12, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

Good catch there. I think I must have been looking in an older version of the article to see if it had a History section that had been removed. --GreenReaper(talk) 06:15, 29 January 2007 (UTC)

page name change request by RVDDP2501[edit]

Hey GreenReaper, Listen, I'm sorry to bother you bu I was wondering if you could change two page names for me, could you add the last name "WhiteEye" to Miki and Rokko for me and I stupidly didn't know one could update a pic on any wiki, I uploaded a new pic of the Rokko character, I was wondering if you could delete the previous version called "Extinctioners_cast_Rokko_by_Ebonyleopard.jpg" for me, thank you I awould really appreciate it, thank you - RVDDP2501 11:47, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

Looks like someone already did it. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:20, 4 February 2007 (UTC)
Ok, thanks :-) - RVDDP2501 16:34, 4 February 2007 (UTC)

just thanking for the welcome[edit]

thanx for the welcome, btw is this the correct etiquette on answering usertalk msgs?

--Tigro Spottystripes 03:03, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

You're welcome, and yes, it is right to respond on the other person's talk page unless they specifically say at the top of it that they will watch yours. Some people will have copies of their conversations on both pages, others may just respond on the page of the person they're talking to. --GreenReaper(talk) 03:06, 8 February 2007 (UTC)

Page move and disambiguation page request[edit]

Hey there. I was wondering if you or one of the other admins could move Orzel to Orzel_Aquila, and add a disambiguation page for Orzel to link to either Orzel_Tastyeagle or Orzel_Aquila. I can't determine how to easily do this myself, so I figure I'll ask you to take care of it for me.

If there is an easy way to do it, point me to the correct place and I'll take care of it myself.

Thanks. --Orzel 08:15, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

Sure! It should be sorted now. --GreenReaper(talk) 08:22, 15 February 2007 (UTC)

What am I[edit]

Hey, i figured youd be the person to ask. I tried looking other places on the wiki, so here it is: Im a 17 year old male into Furry comics and animations(of the adult type). I can see myself engaging in intercourse with anthromoprhic animals, but not animals in real life. I dont fursuit, and im straight. What does this make me on the furry scale? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by DJLO (talkcontribs) .

Hi there! I think I can manage that. Let's take a look on the Official Furry Scale:
0 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10

Rush Limbaugh Mundane Nonfur Comic lovers Roleplayers Homosexuals Fursuiters Therians Plushophiles Skunkf***ers Mark Merlino

You are a 4. Hope that helps! --GreenReaper(talk) 04:46, 17 February 2007 (UTC) Note: Anyone who takes the above seriously deserves to. :-)

Oh man, that is SO wrong. I like it! --Douglas Muth 19:27, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

haha thanks! DJ 20:12, 17 February 2007 (UTC

So this means the average furry is homosexual? I knew it haha!!--Tagenar 22:10, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the Welcome![edit]

Hi GreenReaper, thanks for welcoming me to WikiFur! I've messaged you once before in the FPS IRC channel (under the name wolfi386). I have to say, once again, that WikiFur has been an excellent introduction to the furry fandom for me. Being so new to the fandom (my first exposure to fandom-produced furry artwork was roughly three years ago, but I only started exploring the fandom itself about two months ago), I probably won't be able to expand many articles at first, but I'll do my best at copy-editing and wikification in the meantime! :) --chaos386(talk) 18:55, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Just another member saying thank you[edit]

Hi GreenReaper, I just also wanted to say thanks for the welcome and kind offer of help, I really appreciate the warm welcome. Crimson Divine

Hello and thanks![edit]

Hey GreenReaper! Thanks for your help and for cleaning up my page! You're kindness has not gone unnoticed!! >^.^< --Kitoichi 03:37, 1 March 2007 (UTC)

It was a team effort - but, on behalf of the team, you're welcome! --GreenReaper(talk) 04:12, 1 March 2007 (UTC)


Hello! Regarding your last change to Abando, I did mean the actual site, not the website (it doesn't exist yet). I couldn't find a real word for the meaning, it's a place in the country, it's like a farm but there is no primary sector activity, it's just a private site, and quite large at that, with almost 84 acres (almost 34 ha). There's many pictures at part 2 of this page.

Thank you for the help! :-) Ekevu 13:30, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

Re: Vandals[edit]

No prob - just happened to be fortuitous timing! --Scani 01:51, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

Hey! Thanks for warm the welcome and clean-up of my page. I appreciate it. :D —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tau (talkcontribs) .

Wiki Page, Luca Shoal[edit]

Yes, it was Luca Shoal, I was just too stupid to realize that the character from High Tail was a real person. People make mistakes :). Anyway, thanks for cleaning up my page, I know my phrasing isn't the best in the world. --VosAbeo 17:39, 18 March 2007 (UTC)


I guess at this point GreenReaper should be congratulated for his hard work, having just broken 10,000 Article Edits. --Higgs Raccoon 19:26, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Yipe! Yes, that's been creeping up over time. The irony is that, as the "other" column shows, almost as much of my time is spent not editing articles but instead talking about them with other users. There's only so much I know myself, but I try to magnify that by helping and encouraging others to edit, both on and off of WikiFur. For every edit I've made, another two were made by people in the "top 10", and another three by other members of WikiFur, which - for me - makes it all worthwhile. :-)
I'd also like to take this opportunity to note the contributions of one of our more reclusive editors, and the second on that list. Sine has written many articles from scratch, and has gone to great lengths to fill out numerous sections of WikiFur, including much of the literature and roleplaying areas. It just goes to show that you don't have to have a big name in the fandom - or any name - to be a great wiki editor and administrator. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:10, 25 March 2007 (UTC)

Hey GreenReaper, I did a bunch of edits and additions, I want to make sure they're all okay. Thanks! Sgatsby 22:51, 27 March 2007 (UTC)

Saying hello back[edit]

Hi, I had to create a new account for myself because I forgot my password to the old "Skyfire" ID I made for myself and all attempts to email it to me failed.

Anyway, thanks for welcoming me, Green.  :) —The preceding unsigned comment was added by SkyfireFox (talkcontribs) .

I'm back[edit]

I know I said I was leaving. But I'm done acting like an asshole toward the wrong people. I'm going to stop Therian Temple from going any further, just thought you might care... - cchristian talk

Panda Ratings[edit]

Wow, I never knew Mab's Land's Adopt-a-Panda campaign was that successful...

-Squeegy 04:30, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Regarding their use here? I thought they were cute and I decided, "what the heck, we need something and they're available!" If only more artists were similarly generous with such things. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 04:32, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

i like the change[edit]

but i should add that it certainly didn't belong under the types of content" header. based on the other content that was there, it very much struck me as a criticism. even if i'm mistaken, it doesn't read as one now, and is much better. thank you. Leam 02:27, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks ^_^[edit]

Thanks for the Welcome, Only real questions I'll have will probably be page editing (trying to figure out images atm, and am too stubborn to wade through the help section :P Anyway see you around —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Tyratos (talkcontribs) .

How about unignoring me?[edit]

What in the fuck is your problem you piece of shit pussy faced cunt sucking cock blowing asshole mother fucker?

I wasn't even pissed he fuck off at you you annoying little sack of shit.

All I wanted was for you to UNFUCKINGING IGNORE ME from all of the IM clients you use so that I didn't have to talk to you on IRC from then on.

You had to just provoke me even further by then pissing me the fuck off, giving a smart ass comment "Your right :)" and then ignoring me.


So then you made me take my anger and my rage into the fucking channel and now I'm banned from #wikifur just because I want to talk to your fucking face before I break your god damn fucking nose when I see you in real life.

Suck my fucking dick you piece of fucking whoreshit. Suck it and fucking die. You and your fucking friends and the entirty of this sorry pathetic ass excuse of a community called the furry fandom is really starting to get onto my god damn fucking nerves. I just want to get my access back to all the fucking places I was banned from, get my friends back, and yet all you do is piss me the fuck off worse until I loose it again, and all I mother fucking asked of you was to unignore me on AIM, ICQ, MSN, and YIM, but that's too much to fucking ask for some mother fucking United Kingdom stuck up sack of shit isn't it? You mother fucking foreigners should all fucking die as far as I'm concerned.

All I ask is a simple fucking request, and I can't even get that. So, for the last fucking time, get my god damn name off of your fucking ignore list, unban me, and fucking talk to me.

If you'd noticed, I wasn't even pissed off at you when I first tried to talk to you, THIS TIME IT WAS YOUR FUCKING FAULT YOU SHIT STAIN.


I've spent hours talking to you. It has been unproductive, as you always demand things that I cannot or will not give you, such as entry to other people's sites or full control about the page about you (which I will not give contrary to the WikiFur community's will). I have tried to explain how you can improve your reputation within the fandom, and every time it's been like talking to a brick wall. I see no benefit to further conversation. --GreenReaper(talk) 22:49, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh how I've waited for you to get to the point that you would answer this. You are sad. You are sadly mistaken when you say that talking to me has been unproductive. It hasn't been unproductive, you've just been an unyielding fucking dickhead with a god complex thinking that your on some kind of journey through the world to do what's best for the furry fandom and destroy any individual lives that you might otherwise encounter along the fucking way.

I don't understand why you had to be such a smart ass mother fucking prick when it came to me talking to you on #wikifur. Nor the reason why you had to ignore me on every god damn IM program you ever use. How about unignoring me from IM's, and on WikiFur so that if I need to talk to you, and I do, I don't have to go through your fucking goons to do so?

Speaking of goons, get that mother fucking twit sack of shit SpazKitty off my fucking ass already. What doesn't that prostitute do? She bans me, she blocks my fucking accounts, she's increased the god damn ban against me from three to six months for no fucking reason, she's blocked my alternate accounts, she ignores me, and she's acting like a piece of shitty white trash. Get my fucking ban back down to three months like we originally agreed upon, tell her to go the fuck away from me and leave me alone, and to fuck off. I'm not waiting another three months just because of you sorry as shit mother fucking administrators think your the mother fucking gods of the furry universe.

Banning me or ignoring me is pointless. As you can see it hasn't worked yet, and it will not work in the future, so give it up already and get rid of all your fucking bans against me and let me have control over WikiFur. This is as nice of a request to do as I ask as you'll ever fucking get.


Regarding SpazKitty, as I understand it, you invade her personal webspace, interupt her personal space to bitch and complain to her for whatever reason. If I didn't know better, I'd say that you were on her ass, not vice versa. Aggravating the situation is only going to make things worse. The best way to handle this is to quietly sit your timeout that you were given for your behaviour, then return when it expires and become a productive member of the community. GreenReaper has only blocked you from his personal messengers because of lack of real communication between you. It's become a sad little game you're playing. This is as nice of a response as you're ever going to get.--Kendricks Redtail (one of the "goons")

This is an archive page, covering general talk on my user talk page from 10 June 2007 to 3 May 2008. Please do not edit this page - if you wish to bring up a topic, copy the relevant portion into a new section on the current page. Thanks! --GreenReaper(talk)


You added a link to the ED article on yourself... to your own page here? I don't mean any offense or anything, it's just a little curious, since Encyclopedia Dramatica isn't really the most flattering site to be featured on... - Saruuk

No, I didn't. --GreenReaper(talk) 17:09, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Greetings From Halopedia![edit]

Greetings Sentient, The entity Saboteur and the entity Iratus have been been deleted. Make no further Contact, As their memory Matrix are now both mine and currently under Investigation. I am sorry this has caused you problems. Take care. 1707<Umbra>-Security A.I. of Halopedia

Sorry for that, It's more for effect, anyways, down to buisness. I am aware You had 2 Users by the names of Saboteur and Iratus, and that they both apparently vandalized pages of your Site. I Regret to inform You that these were both the same Person. And I know exactly who (I cannot say his name due to privacy rights). I work on Halopedia mostly at my school, and as a result, I had a bonehead who watched what I was doing. He did not like me much and as a result, created a account and vandalized my page. When we booted him, he must have moved onto you page and vandalized your files. (As why your Site, He hated anything that was not gangsta or of gangster style and just ran across your site.) I regret all that has happened and hope for the best the damage was minimal(May I ask How bad The Damage Was? He usually like rape,porn and sex related "Stuff"). If you wish to contact me, Leave a message on this site, or more preferably on Halopedia on the Userpage WRAITH as I will likely forget this site and you message! Anyways I lok forward to seeing you in the future and wish you the best of Luck. Regards; WRAITH-Halopedia Representitive

WikiFur News[edit]

Despite the bashing the last furry convention article received, will you consider posting WikiFur News' reportage of Anthrocon to Wikinews? We're always looking for original reporting, especially from reporters who's writing is as strong and interesting as yours. -- Zanimum 19:49, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Sure, as long as Wikinews doesn't mind it going up here as well. I may decide to condense the end result somewhat for Wikinews, as I plan to make several shorter posts here as ongoing coverage. Others may also be writing about it, but WikiFur News is dual-licensed CC-BY-2.5 so there should be no problem with that. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:12, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Indeed, stories are already in development. --GreenReaper(talk) 21:43, 3 July 2007 (UTC)
Just thinking, you have to tell people WikiFur News contributors that any changes they make to your article on this site are co-licensed as CC-BY, not just the normal GFDL. As soon as I typed that, I read about the dual licensing, that's great! I don't know why the Wikia default is GFDL, instead of Creative Commons, GFDL is such a weird license, since you technically have to reprint a whole three-page document with even just a sentence excerpted.
Yeah, whatever length or format you'd like.
I've published the article about the play, and tacked on a "in other news" bit from this article, just to highlight the whole charitable element. Thanks! -- Zanimum 14:37, 4 July 2007 (UTC)
Hi, I've asked the anon on their talk page, about this edit. Hopefully they reply.
Great article on the con on Wikinews, I've reworded a little teeny bit here and there, and added a definition of what a fursuit is. (When I posted your play article, people were entirely dumbfounded what a furry is, which is I guess better than the default response so many have.
I've added Lucky Coyote's pic to the fursuit article on Wikipedia. Do you know Blondefoxy to any extent? Presumably she has no qualms against the picture use, however I had asked a few weeks ago if she'd release a picture of Lucky or Lucky + Skuffy(?) under a Creative Commons license for Wikipedia, no reply. I don't want to peave anyone off... -- Zanimum 16:18, 18 July 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for adding your clarification to the article. Sometimes it's hard to know what things do or don't need further explaining in the body text (the article was already very long, so I was hesitant to put in much more exposition). I didn't know you posted the one about the play; I've added that to the related news section.
I must admit that I do not know Blondefoxy/Lucky personally, and indeed I did not know that was another name of hers. Most fursuiters tend to be fairly happy about people showing off their costumes, though, and Lucky was one of those actively participating in group skits and posing for pictures. You could try the other contact details on her deviantART account if you really want to contact her about it. Oh, and her mate is Skuff Coyote. --GreenReaper(talk) 17:05, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Kalika Futago[edit]

The article for Kalika Futago needs to be renamed Kalika Tybera. She changed her furry name to reflect her marriage to her mate, Nace Tybera (BigKittyWolf). --Kitch 22:08, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Looks like someone was watching. And thank you for your recent donation! The WikiFur account was looking a little low after all of those Anthrocon purchases. --GreenReaper(talk) 22:18, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

6-2-1 rule[edit]

I noticed you removed this edit, and I was wondering why - do you know it to be false? --GreenReaper(talk) 22:17, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Do we know it to be true? ;) Without a citation or even an edit summary, I'm loathe to assign a single creator to a term based on an anonymous edit. Spaz Kitty 01:09, 12 July 2007 (UTC)
Also, a bit of snooping into recent edits shows that the person named is the creator of the "new" 6-2-1 rule, not the original. The edit I reverted lists him as the creator of the original 6-2-1 rule. Spaz Kitty 01:13, 12 July 2007 (UTC)


First they came for the babyfurs, and I did not speak out, because I was not a babyfur.

Then they came for the plushies, and I did not speak out, because I was not a plushie.

Then they came for the balloonies, and I did not speak out, because I was not a balloonie.

Then they came for me . . . and there was no one left to speak out for me.

Where did the line "First they came for... and I did not speak out, because I was not a... Than they came for me...and there was no one left to speak out for me" line come from? Sirtim 12:16, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Martin Niemöller. See Wikipedia:First they came.... --GreenReaper(talk) 18:27, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you[edit]

Thanks for your welcoming me, this is my first time in this kind of encyclopedical sites. - Gato Gris

New User on Wiki[edit]

From Wynther Knight About LXF

Hi there, thanks for letting me know someone is here to help. It's actually my time to do an article on an Wiki and I'm still trying to learn the ropes. Thanks for letting me know about the "show preview" button, as I still have toms of stuff to put in.

Thank you again :)

Wolves' Paradise Encyclopedia[edit]

Wolves' Paradise has set up a Paradise Encyclopedia that you can take a look at it. However it's license is CC-by-nd-sa(!) so it is impossible to share content between WPE and WikiFur. --猫夜叉NekoYasha(talk) 03:33, 3 September 2007 (UTC)

Tales from the Reservation[edit]

Saw what you did on TFTR & AJA pages....

Thanks! :D Now comes the fun part - re-reading and providing a better description of the story(as well as figuring out how to scan it in as a PDF without having each part be over 17MB in size :)) ). 12:59, 17 September 2007 (UTC)

Carpe Diem[edit]

I'm flattered that Carpe Diem got the featured comic of the week/day/whatever. I also saw the new page, and was more flattered that someone took the time to do all that. I'll probably be adding to it, but I just wanted to say thanks. It made my day. :)

Graveyard Greg September 25, 2007

No problem, and thanks for your additions. It always helps to get an authoritative source of information involved. :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 01:33, 27 September 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for noticing,[edit]

I just added a little bit of information to the MewYear page. I might add some more at a later time if some hasn`t done it by then already. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by O kill (talkcontribs) .

Timeline of media coverage[edit]

Am I correct in assuming you did not intend to remove all of the pre-2007 material from Timeline of media coverage? --mwalimu 13:49, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Yeep, no. Chalk that up to not checking I was editing the right thing after a browser restart. --GreenReaper(talk) 14:17, 8 November 2007 (UTC)

Of interest?[edit]

Look at it before the end of the week, when they take it private. Stumbled across it in an ad industry email newsletter, thought I'd drop by, just in case you thought it was worth mentioning in Wikifur. -- Zanimum 15:33, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Hehe, yeah . . . they actually made a whole video out of it which made the rounds a week or so ago. Perhaps it'll help attract new blood to FranFurence! ;-) --GreenReaper(talk) 16:13, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Dalhusky the dog here.[edit]

Hello, GreenReaper. It has been about three years since I wrote that "Furry Irony" post. At this moment, I am somewhat of a different person now than I was when I posted that article. I cannot easily explain what I mean by that. I am a very complicated person.

But what I am trying to say is that I have been blown away by the fact that so many people like to hate and bash people like me for being aroused by a cartoon picture or a real animal. I have certain likings that even many furries detest. I also bailed out of a troll war on YouTube and canceled my MaxSnowDog account in hopes of removing some terrible baggage recently due to my trying to tell people about my beliefs with regards to zoophilia and getting threats along with a very stupid E.D. article about me. Maybe we could talk together sometime because I would rather chat than post because of the way I'm feeling currently.

Furry sexuality survey[edit]

Hi there.

I was wanting to report a story on WikiFur News, but seeing as how I am one of the people involved with the story, I do not believe I am able to under WikiFur rules.

The story in question is that I have organised a survey to look into furry sexuality - the first survey to look pacificly into this topic. It is reported in The Furtean Times. So far, over 100 people have answered the survey, and granted, a few issues have been brought up. If you want to write up the story or ask me questions about it, please ask me.

ISD 12:01, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

I'll try and take a look at this tonight. Sorry for the delay, it's been very busy here at work these last few weeks. --GreenReaper(talk) 18:07, 11 December 2007 (UTC)
Thanks for looking. ISD 21:40, 11 December 2007 (UTC)

Comics and webcomics[edit]

Hi again. I don't think you remember me, but that isn't important now. I have a couple of questions (sorry my horrible english). I've saw here furry webcomics being show. My questions:

1. There are specific rules for publish information for a webcomic? 2. What it needs a webcomic for being considered "furry"? I ask this because in VG Cats, even if the main characters are 2 furry cats, the comic isn't furry.

Why I ask this? Because I have a webcomic. The main character is a fuzzy furry creature, but even if she uses its furry enchant for charming everyone this webcomic is ambiented in the "real world".

And the other thing: A webcomic, must to be in english for being here? Because the comic is in spanish (my naive language).

Thanks for the time for answering those questions :) --DragonTrainer - Flamewars here, please. 12:42, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

Hi DragonTrainer! Apologies for the delay, I've been a bit busy at work recently.
There is no requirement for comics to be in English - indeed, we are quite interested in hearing about such things in other languages. The language of the comic should be noted on the article. Similarly, it is not a requirement for events to take place in a completely furry world - a comic dealing with the actions of a single furry character or group of characters is fine.
As for the information - ideally the things we write on WikiFur are facts that could be taken from the website about the comic, or from other sources. If the comic is in Spanish, then it is fine for that information to be in Spanish there, as long as your summary of it on WikiFur is in English. --GreenReaper(talk) 04:55, 15 January 2008 (UTC)
Thanks. I'll start to create the article :) --DragonTrainer - Flamewars aquí, por favor. 12:41, 15 January 2008 (UTC)

Brushwell Clinton[edit]

I've had a chat with Brushwell and he mentioned that he always intended to put it at User:Brushwell_Clinton/My_History and thought that he had done so, even though he did not the first two times. --GreenReaper(talk) 19:22, 26 January 2008 (UTC)
Next chat you have with him, you might like to discuss the iffy practice of redirecting your Article page to your User page.--Higgs Raccoon 08:13, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
Yeah, that's not on. I've reverted that edit. --GreenReaper(talk) 15:09, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

News:Furry charity events raise over $60,000 in 2007[edit]

Know when the "exact figures from RCFM and FWA" will be available? This would be great for Wikinews. -- Zanimum 18:27, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

I've been chatting with Brody but he hasn't been able to dig them up yet. Also contacted Kiran Lightpaw but don't believe I got anything back. --GreenReaper(talk) 20:46, 1 March 2008 (UTC)
Even if you can get only one of the two, that would be enough to make it current, and news in terms of Wikinews' standards. -- Zanimum 21:54, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Furtopia Hack News Story[edit]

Hello Sir!

I added a paragraph to the Furtopia news story concerning a possible claim for responsibility. It appeared on the Furtopia community journal. The link is the following:

I usually don't edit things myself and would rather leave these things to the real editors! But according to your user page you will be gone for awhile... I hope this suffices for the moment.

I thought you would like to know.

Thank you


I'm still new to all of this furry fandom and you may have seen my posts on the forum. I just want to thank you for having this accepting atmoshpere. If everyones realization was as overwelming as mine we all need a place to talk Xeans 22:48, 12 March 2008 (UTC)

Hopefully you'll find that acceptance is a part of the furry community elsewhere as well. Welcome aboard! :-) --GreenReaper(talk) 23:02, 12 March 2008 (UTC)


What are they, the creatures wiki gives some pretty detailed info on the game, but it's from a stanspoint that would only be helpful to someone who has played the games before...

So what is it about?

-YAY BUNNIES :3 14:23, 25 March 2008 (UTC)

Creatures is about breeding and taking care of digital life forms called norns. It takes place in a relatively benign world, which nevertheless has a number of passive and active hazards (including other creatures) which the player must guard against - or not, as they wish.
The creatures have a form of "digital DNA" which determines their drives, instincts and the chemical reactions which sustain them. They may also learn new things as a result of their interaction with the world - for example, they might learn that hot things hurt them, and so should be avoided (unless their DNA is wired to tell them that pain is good - or even allows it to live off pain as a source of nourishment). On mating, the DNA of one parent is mixed with that of another, and parts may be added or removed, which may or may not result in viable offspring.
Like the norns, the world itself is alive, to an extent. It has various scripted objects in the world - food, toys, tools, or even other animals - which the creatures (and sometimes the player) can interact with. The objects may reproduce themselves, or more commonly be created by a parent object.
Creatures is distinguished from similar games in many ways: perhaps the biggest is that the brain, chemical systems and the surrounding world are simulated in far more depth; and death is not only a fact of life, but a common one, though it remains emotionally charged (especially for the target audience).
The game series spawned a wide array of customizations that continues to this day, with hundreds of new breeds of the various species in the game (some looking nothing like the originals), new or modified objects and new worlds for the creatures to inhabit. --GreenReaper(talk) 17:06, 25 March 2008 (UTC)


IM me. AIM removed --Kitch (Talk : Contrib) 01:18, 22 April 2008 (UTC)


Good Evening GreenReaper, thanks for the e-mail. Actually there are a few things that I would like to find out about WikiFur, that would enhance my presence on the site. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Rukario (talkcontribs) .